[unparsed]Wow, the new road map is huge! And the level of details is amazing. I could never come up with so many names for cities, villages etc. How long has it taken you to create it?
Posted February 15th, 2010
[unparsed][quote:26b89dfa7d]I could never come up with so many names for cities, villages etc. How long has it taken you to create it?[/quote:26b89dfa7d]
Very good question ! :)
The map has been made slowly, during some evenings or sundays. I began it last november (and it is not finished). Of course, it uses the geologic and geomorphologic study of Celtis I have been made last years. But it's not a huge work. In fact, the more tiring is to imagine names. It's why I have a trick : the names file.
This is a huge text file with all geographic names of my world. This file has been completed step by step since 2006. Before 2006, I created some names without checking if it still exist, and (more important) without creating languages. In 2006, I decided to begin again. I created a text file with all the names previously used. Then, I created hints for the languages. Just hints. I gathered together the names which have similarites, so I obtain a file with the old names reorganized.
The next years, I added some names from time to time. For example, I saw in a forum a pseudo which could become a maraquin name (Maraquin is the langage of Belicia, Moscorea, Valmoe and Evanea) : Frimayo. Today, Frimayo is one of the oldest cities of Belicia.
In Celtis, I organized names according to the geographical regions. For example, the names in East often finish with vowel+c (or q) or vowel+t : Saint-Remi-de-Rac, Castellac, Viq-le-Neuf, Lebrot, Andelot... The file was very useful for this reorganization, it contains names for each provinces.
Here is an example of this file (today, it is a HTML file, more pleasant to look at) :
(Hints for the language ; regions ; islands ; rivers ; cities)
[code:1:26b89dfa7d]<b>> GRANDE ALBE (Alb)</b></p>
<u>Langue :</u>Alba (variante éloignée du Selba).
<li> fins en 'Vc', 'Vn', 'Vs' ou plus rarement 'V', 'Vr'
<li> lettres 'm', 'r' et 'u' assez courante (contrairement au Selba)
<li> 'ch' rare
<li> consonnes doubles : 'sc', 'rs', 'sp'
<li> voyelles doubles : 'aa', 'oo'
<li> son 'and'
<li> Remarque : le mot "hamac" est de langue Alba.
Régions : Abora - Andilac - Ascas - Baalbac - Boota - Buc - Caradoc - Caras - Carseroc - Caspac - Catarac - Curceli - Cursac - Cuspac - Ican - Moorec - Naroc - Nicas - Oriman - Orinoc - Oroman - Scavon - Tanoc - Yaban - Yalbec - Yarcan - Yaspac.</p>
Îles : Baruc (une des Petites Albes) - Cabaras - Calduc - Charmac - Cotac - Curuc - Jarcan (une des Petites Albes) - Mandac - Moati - Ogini - Samuc - Sanjuc - Tuc - Turuc - Ulaspac - Urapac - Yavari - Yayac.</p>
Fleuves : Abalic [v. Balic] - Arandi - Asicola - Balic - Cameni [fleuve principal] - Caricori - Cirso - Curandi - Eramac - Ipala - Latilac - Pacola - Pariga - Raloc - Ramac - Vascalan - Yayanic.</p>
Villes : Ac Catatoni - Ac Scamani - Alcaaro - Balan Baruc [v. Baruc] - Balan Basca - Balan Paana - Bascan - Bonigor - Bo Bandoc - Bo Canda - Bo Lago - Braca - Caala Baruc [v. Baruc] - Caala Bomoroc - Caala Botatan [grande ville] - Caala Curo - Caala Cursac [v. Cursac] - Caala Yascula - Caligero - Calicosca - Cali Yarsa - Canduc [ville ancienne] - Can Pere - Caritina - Caspati - Catasar - Catiscari - Cosa Bisican - Cosa Lago - Curascan - Cutan Saari - Larmosca - Lasca - Malban - Mantica [grande ville] - Maranduc (=Marinduc, capitale) - Mascari [grande ville] - Molbe Cosicon - Octabor - Pacan Tuc [V. Tuc] - Pan Atina - Pan Caali - Pan Pacto - Rascari - Rascam Boori - Rilati [grande ville] - Seritina - Tacan Tica - Talgo - Vaasa Boroc - Vaasa Cosicon - Vaasa Valibor - Vaasa Vaspac - Valati - Vantisca - Yargo Yasca.</p>
Thanks to such a list, creating the map of Grande-Albe (this name is in langue Franche, not in Alba) will be easier. Without it, I will lost time by searching new names...
Posted February 15th, 2010
[unparsed]A good idea. I should also make such a file before I continue developing Avaron's map.
Posted February 16th, 2010
[unparsed]My only major critique is that it looks a bit too regular/even. Although this may be for lack of detailed examination; perhaps if coloured more boldly I would be able to more easily see unevenness.
I don't mean regular as in shape (shape is good), but just that the web of roads covers too much, too evenly. If there were more barren areas where there weren't roads, it would be a bit more realistic- and if there were more useless roads.
Spend some time on good maps, most places on Earth, one can be astounded by the inefficiency. Sometimes [often!] roads just get built in useless places because a senator/emperor/whatever has a mistress somewhere, and he wants to cut down on his/her commute- or a contractor somewhere sweetened a pot with a bribe.
Posted February 16th, 2010
[unparsed]Thank you Blake for your comments ! What I appreciate from you is thay you are demanding. But this is the best way to progress... :)
[quote:a7e85bf476]My only major critique is that it looks a bit too regular/even.[/quote:a7e85bf476]
I agree, but not totally...
Look at a map of France : it is 99 % regular.
Look at a map of California : the opposite.
Celtis is an intermediate case, but more similar to France.
The area presented on this map has latitude from about 47° to 57°. The oceanic climate is the same as in northern France (47°-50°), England, Ireland (52°-55°) and Scotland (55°-57°). The eastern region is more continental, about the same as Germany. I own a road atlas of Europe (at the same scale) and was inspired by it. For example, the Fiermont province (the northern province of Celtis) has similarities with Scotland. There are not many roads.
But I am a little disappointed, not by Fiermont but by the eastern provinces : the global view seems too even, you are right. Celtis is a modern nation without deserts and, as Europe countries, the road network is well developped. But the forests regions (north-east) are too regular. I would prefered to have large areas without roads and other areas with more density. Nevertheless, there is differences of densities. Not very impressive, but perhaps more realistic than my aesthetic preferences. (If I want to have great areas without roads and cities, I would have to create Celtis in an other place !) I don't know, and it is not very important for me since I think this is enough realistic for me.
[quote:a7e85bf476]Spend some time on good maps, most places on Earth[/quote:a7e85bf476]
I love to watch maps and I own maps of many places in the World. When creating imaginary maps, I often use real maps. Celtis is like European countries, but for example there is a large continent which looks like Australia : when I will draw the maps of this continent, I will use my Australia maps.
Posted February 16th, 2010
[unparsed]Up to you, of course, but I think your hypothetical edit you mentioned would at least be interesting to try out and see how it looks :)
Posted February 17th, 2010
[unparsed]I think it's an astonishing work. You must be very patient, both in your work and in the organization of your writings. Mine are far more messy and if I tried to put up such files like you did, I would probably end up half way done.
Those maps look great. Especially because their are hand drawn. I really like the mountains with this "shading". From childhood on I always enjoyed looking at maps and atlases (is that the right plural??) and I can see that passion running throughout your work.
I really don't feel like critizising anything, just keep up the good work.
By the way, what is your profession? Maybe you will have a look at the works of HandsomeRob, since he is a professional cartographer, for inspiration.
Posted February 17th, 2010
[unparsed]Thank you Vaja !
[quote:555f075651]You must be very patient, both in your work and in the organization of your writings.[/quote:555f075651]
In my opinion, the harder is to begin. In this map, I began by one of the most little province, it was more easy.
[quote:555f075651]if I tried to put up such files like you did, I would probably end up half way done.[/quote:555f075651]
Note that my map is only half done... (In fact, there will be a second map for the southern regions, I already began it.)
[quote:555f075651]From childhood on I always enjoyed looking at maps and atlases (is that the right plural??) and I can see that passion running throughout your work.[/quote:555f075651]
Like me ! When I was a child, one of my games was to draw maps of imaginary worlds. Then, with my brother, we played with our worlds. This is how began Celtis and its planet... Of course, I loved to read atlases, and my father's suffered because of me : at about five years old, I invented a country drawing it directly on the atlas ! (south of Tunisia, where there was place to add a country... :))
[quote:555f075651]what is your profession?[/quote:555f075651]
Math teacher (very useful for map projections...) When I was a child, I wanted to be cartographer, but after my teenage years, I forgot that, thinking it was not very serious. Maybe a mistake...
[quote:555f075651]Maybe you will have a look at the works of HandsomeRob[/quote:555f075651]
His maps are probably the best imaginary maps I have ever seen. But I am affraid there are too difficult for me to inspire...
Posted February 17th, 2010
[unparsed]That's a really good map.
Posted February 18th, 2010
by Cheka Man
[unparsed]Another teacher here, that's great. I'm becoming a teacher for physics and english and I also find it useful for conworlding.
So basically you developed the world you thought of in your earliest years? For me, conwolrding is more collecting the shards of ideas that run through my brain all the time. Your work looks so dedicated and straight-forward, it seems well organized. How long have you modeled the world in your mind, before you drew the map? Was it a concrete image in your mind you started from, or did your world form while you made those maps?
Posted February 18th, 2010
[unparsed][quote:95e0e34a7b]So basically you developed the world you thought of in your earliest years?[/quote:95e0e34a7b]
In fact, the world have changed. I developed several versions. When I was a child, I created an imaginary world as a play (for example I imagined football teams and drawed imaginary players). Then, I forgot it. And several years later, being a student, I decided to start again. The main reason was I discovered that creating a realistic world needs to have knowledge in many sciences, and I love reading science books. I remember a long discussion with a friend who study geology (he is now a biology & geology teacher), which was very important because it convinced me to learn geology, then climatology, then etc.
What has not been changed since my childhood is that in this planet, there is a country which I developped with more precision (where they speak french). The name of this country was Gremm (capital Gremmaggnes) - a very childish word...When I started again all this world, I decided to change many names. Gremmaggnes became Rivalide, Gremm became Celtis, Rataville became Corange...
[quote:95e0e34a7b]How long have you modeled the world in your mind, before you drew the map?[/quote:95e0e34a7b]
I am not sure to understand.
I have many things in mind which are not drawed or written. For example, Celtisians love horseriding, unlike me. I don't know why, but it seems logical to me (maybe because Celtis is a large country with many forests ?). These ideas have no connection with the map.
The map is the conclusion of a long work. The current version was created at summer of 2001. I gave Celtis the shape of the land of Hesse, which I like, then drawed the shapes of the main continents after placing the main tectonic plates.
- In 2002 and 2003, I wrote a geologic study of Celtis, then the climate. But there were some errors and, about 2004 and 2005, I was not able to obtain something which satisfies me.
- Summer 2006 : I redo the work of 2001, but with new knowledges.
- 2007 : the most important year. The main descriptions of geology and geomorphy of Celtis were ready. I wanted to draw a geomorphic map but had no time...
- (2008 and 2009 were important for the world in general, but I developped few things in Celtis, for example the history.)
- Summer 2009 : I drawed the geomorphic map of Celtis (at last). The next step is the road map, which is the current work. (After the road map will be the tour guide).
[quote:95e0e34a7b]Was it a concrete image in your mind you started from, or did your world form while you made those maps?[/quote:95e0e34a7b]
For the current version (2001), I have some ideas in mind. I wanted a continent similar to Europe, because it is more easy to make it realistic, but larger, because I wanted Celtis to be larger than France. I wanted also a continent which have the shape of the infrared map of Orion, because I love this shape (it is Orelia). And I wanted to keep all countries of the old version, because of the football teams (but I changed names). Then, I thought about the tectonic plates. Then, I drawed draft maps for the continents (and oceans). Then I detailed the continents, etc. (geology --> geomorphy --> climatology --> ecology --> history --> present situation).
I am not creating this world by creating maps ; maps are only the conclusion of the creation of this world.
Posted February 18th, 2010
[unparsed]Is that geomorphic map available? I would love to see it.
I like how put a lot of effort into your world, to make it realistic. You seem to know a lot of decent details about geography, what can obviously seen in your map-making.
For the infrared map, do you mean something like [url=http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/image/0504/orion_iras_big.jpg]this[/url]? That's a nice source of inspiration. Are into the astronomy of your world? Do you know anything about the planet and its solar system? You have a well developed geography. Especially to bear in mind the tectonics and the geomorphology is great and adds a huge amount of realism.
I just had an intresting thought: If your world is situated in another place in the universe then earth, how does the night sky look like? Can they see Orion as you can see it? I have never thought about how the celestial constrellations change, when you "move" the planet.
I also try to make my conworld rather realistic, but I alter it where I want to, because I want to have a specific 'magical' flavor to it. Does your world contain anything like magic, or something that goes beyond todays sciences?
Posted February 19th, 2010
[unparsed]Thank you Vaja for your questions ! I like to speak about my world...
[quote:b7e5ad561b]Is that geomorphic map available? I would love to see it.[/quote:b7e5ad561b]
Yes, see here : http://conworlds.info/cwbb/viewtopic.php?t=945 , message from Mon Sep 14, 2009, map 2).
[quote:b7e5ad561b]For the infrared map, do you mean something like this?[/quote:b7e5ad561b]
Yes ! I have a book where this is more "shaped".
[quote:b7e5ad561b]Are into the astronomy of your world? Do you know anything about the planet and its solar system?[/quote:b7e5ad561b]
The other planets were described several years ago (I imagined them when I was a child, but without descriptions). I used the Bode-Titius' law for the distances of planets and their satellites, the Kepler's laws for computing the periods of revolution, etc.
The planets are (from near to far) Tantor, Obi, Earth, Phot, Starter, asteroids, Titan, Scapulo, Arca. Note that there are 5 telluric planets, not 4. The larger telluric planet is not Earth but Starter. The asteroids are at the same distance than Jupiter. There are 3 gazeous planets. Titan is similar to Jupiter but at the distance of Saturn. The solar system is very similar to ours because I am not sure of the consequences of a different one. For example, I know that a giant planet at Mars' place is a bad idea : Earth would not exist. I need a Moon because it has probably an important part in the apparition of life, and because of the tides (which are necessary to have estuaries, for example).
Here is a part of the text file describing the "solar system" (the last two planets), quickly translated :
a = 19.4429 UA
e = 0.0035 (2.891 - 2.911 billion km)
i = 10.1533°
T = 85.7317 years
R = 43076 km, R' = 40980 km
P = 15h03m33s (equator) - retrograde rotation
D = 1.20
Giant planet with 17 thin rings (61000 - 71000 km), not well known before the space probes. High albedo. Scapulo has more than 20 satellites, the main being :
- Sc4 = Megalia : radius 75 km
- Sc5 = Sorde
- Sc6 = Fugis : radius 155 km, a = 121.000 km
- Sc7 = Orcania : radius 600 km, a = 212.000 km
- Sc8 = Armigo : radius 475 km, a = 303.000 km
- Sc9 = Chelis : radius 1725 km, a = 485.000 km
- Sc10 = Hymer : radius 650 km, a = 848.000 km
- Sc11 = Calen : radius 65 km, a = 1.580.000 km
Chelis has a little satellite (radius 10 km), Chelis B.
a = 36.7124 UA
e = 0.1541
i = 0.3684°
T = 222.443 ans
R = 22606 km, R' = 20180 km
P = 15.336 hours
D = 1.66
Gazeous planet, greenish, with ammoniac. It has no complete rings but pieces of rings. There is only one important satellite, Sosten, and more than 10 tiny others.
Sosten : radius = 1300 km, very excentric orbit (e = 0.658), a = 7302000 km , P = 3.95 days. The largers of the other satellites are Nuica (radius 65 km), Phol (radius 33 km) and Raen (radius 28 km).
[quote:b7e5ad561b]how does the night sky look like? Can they see Orion as you can see it? I have never thought about how the celestial constrellations change, when you "move" the planet.[/quote:b7e5ad561b]
Very interesting question ! When we were children, my brother and me imagined that our worlds belong to the same universe than the real world. We had few knowledge in astronomy but knowed (approximatively) what is a galaxy, so we imagined that our worlds each belong to another galaxy. Today, I prefer imagine that this is another universe (two planets with human beings, where they speak almost the same language... impossible !) I had already thought about creating imaginary constellations but never began it. I have in mind the Triad, a constellation with three first magnitude stars, but nothing else.
[quote:b7e5ad561b]Does your world contain anything like magic, or something that goes beyond todays sciences?[/quote:b7e5ad561b]
No, because what interests me is to know about (real) science.
Posted February 19th, 2010
[unparsed]Your conworld probably makes you know a lot about sciences :).
You even worked out the solar system your world is located in, that's amazing. But probably a conworlder just needs that thrill of perfectionism.
The geomorphic map is also great, but I didn't like the colors. I prefer whole areas covered with colors to symbolize with kind of material is there. The mass of lines and descriptions is confusing me. Nevertheless, the level of detail is remarkable. The color critisism also holds for your other maps as well. I always liked these hues form green over yellow to brown to express height, for example.
Have you ever heard or even used terragen? I think you may like this device, since it allows you to model some valleys or bays. With the details you got, you may work out some nice panoramas! Go for [url=http://www.planetside.co.uk]planetside.co.uk[/url] and check out these galleries. Maybe this program is useful for you. And I would love to see some impressions from your world.
By the way: What do you "use" your world for? Is it for writing stories? Or just for the fun of creating? Or perhaps you have drawn some images of how the world looks like beside the maps?
Posted February 22nd, 2010
[unparsed][quote:2ed55ee5e4]The geomorphic map is also great, but I didn't like the colors. I prefer whole areas covered with colors to symbolize with kind of material is there. The mass of lines and descriptions is confusing me. [/quote:2ed55ee5e4]
It's because the goal is not to draw a geomorphic map. This map is only a tool, so it is more a sketch than a map. In fact, 99 % of my work are descriptions and sketches.
[quote:2ed55ee5e4]Have you ever heard or even used terragen? I think you may like this device, since it allows you to model some valleys or bays.[/quote:2ed55ee5e4]
I don't know what it is, I will search...
[quote:2ed55ee5e4]By the way: What do you "use" your world for? Is it for writing stories? Or just for the fun of creating? Or perhaps you have drawn some images of how the world looks like beside the maps?[/quote:2ed55ee5e4]
Still an excellent question ! When I was a child, the goal was to play. This is why I stopped it after my teenage years. Today, there are two goals : 1) the fun (this is a creative and relaxing activity), 2) creating a realistic world motivates me to read science books (without my imaginary world, I would not have learnt about geology, ecology, history, etc.) The second point is important : it is what gave me the will to resume my child creation.
Posted February 23rd, 2010
[unparsed]The road map is finished !
- The northern part (2864 Kb) : http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/6297/celtisn.jpg
- The southern part (2543 Kb) : http://img830.imageshack.us/img830/9049/celtiss.jpg
But I have some ideas for change, including the distribution of names of towns and villages. (Argh, I will probably have to draw a new the map...)
Posted September 6th, 2010
[unparsed]Those are some pretty awesome maps.
Posted November 8th, 2010
[unparsed](Argh, it's a mistake...)
(I will soon post news of my world, I have to scan some pictures, it's in progress.)
Posted January 4th, 2016
[unparsed]I can’t see anything on imageshack unless I join imageshack.
And the links to CWBB use the old tld.
So unfortunately I can’t see what anyone was talking about.
Posted December 30th, 2018