Roleplaying Video Games Entertainment & Media Politics & World
General Spirituality & Philosophy Worldbuilding Creative Forum
The Sports Center Science, Math, & Technology The Nostalgia Forum Sexuality
Community feedback needed: add_comment New add_comment New request

Video Games

Best Zelda Bracket

Posted 3 Weeks ago by Jet Presto

Doing another bracket to determine the best Zelda game! First round looks like this:

Breath of the Wild vs. Four Swords Adventures

The Legend of Zelda vs. Adventure of Link

A Link to the Past vs. Spirit Tracks

Link's Awakening vs. Oracle of Ages/Seasons

Ocarina of Time vs Minish Cap

Majora's Mask vs. Phantom Hourglass

Twilight Princess vs. Skyward Sword

A Link Between Worlds vs. The Wind Waker

Polls for each round will be open for just over 24 hours, so be sure to check every day!

Go to link

There are 31 Replies


For the first round, I'm going:

BREATH OF THE WILD over Four Swords Adventure

Easy choice. There are a number of these games that just aren't accessible to me. Haven't played Four Swords/Four Swords Adventures so BotW wins by default. Though from what I've seen and heard, I imagine I'd go BotW even if I could play Four Swords.

THE LEGEND OF ZELDA over Adventure of Link

I don't think either of these games are particularly fun to play today if you don't have nostalgia for either, but TLoZ is clearly the better game. I do appreciate that they showed right away with the sequel that they aren't going to make any two Zelda games exactly alike, but, well, I was at least able to finish the original game. Plays a lot better than Zelda II.

A LINK TO THE PAST over Spirit Tracks

Another match-up where one wins by default, but A Link to the Past is also one of my favorite Zelda games in the series. To me, LttP is also sort of where my idea of what a Zelda game is kinda actually kicks off in earnest. Kinda like how Final Fantasy IV is sorta where I think Final Fantasy as a franchise *really* found its footing, I feel the same about Link to the Past.

LINK'S AWAKENING over Oracle of Ages/Seasons

I actually did like the Oracle games, even though I never finished them. Mostly I just got sick of playing on my tiny GameBoy Advance. Got stuck on a boss, and some of the environmental puzzles were pretty obtuse. But overall, the Oracle games is the last time - prior to BotW - where I remember noting some tough bosses. That said, Link's Awakening is also a classic and has a slightly unfair advantage in having a remake for the Switch, which I really loved from start to finish. The remake is one of my favorites.

OCARINA OF TIME over Minish Cap

Another one where I don't have access to Minish Cap so never played it. But Ocarina is a classic and I almost feel like we're at the point that enough time has gone by that it's starting to get *under* appreciated and underrated a tad.

MAJORA'S MASK over Phantom Hourglass

Again, I don't have access to handhelds really, so Majora's Mask wins by default. I don't loooove MM, but I appreciate it. To me it's kinda like, *the* quintessential Zelda game. Mostly fun. Lots of things I don't like in it. Kind of obtuse at times. More "interesting" than it is "fun." But it's interesting enough that I mostly liked it.

TWILIGHT PRINCESS over Skyward Sword

I mean, Twilight Princess is a top 3 or 4 Zelda at worst. Skyward Sword is barely playable today. I'm still going back and forth on whether or not I check out the remaster for Switch when it releases, but the motion controls were hardly my only issue with it. Still, a lack of motion controls might make it actually playable.

THE WIND WAKER over A Link Between Worlds

This one bums me out a bit because I have to pick Wind Waker since I was actually able to play it, but from what I've heard of A Link Between Worlds, I really wish I could have played it first. I have a sneaking suspicion that if I had access to it, I'd probably pick it here, alas. WW isn't a *bad* game, but especially in its original form, it is flawed as heck, often rotating between tedious and mindlessly easy. Visually, it's aged well because of its distinct aesthetic and style, which I do really like! But overall, I can't say that it's a top 5 Zelda game for me.



How do you lean for the first round?

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

I didn't play enough Zelda to vote fairly, but Twilight Princess was one of my favorite adventure games full stop. Breath of The Wild is one of the greatest of all time. Wind Waker was nice... but left a lot to be desired. I feel BoTW is accomplishing what Wind Waker and Twilight Princess wanted to do, but couldn't.

So for me anyways... BoTW > Twilight Princess > Wind Waker.

But they're all good at different things. TP's story through the Goron Mines, Ilia, and Midna was absolutely exceptional.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

Round 2 is up.

Breath of the Wild vs. Legend of Zelda

A Link to the Past vs. Link's Awakening

Ocarina of Time vs. Majora's Mask

Twilight Princess vs. Wind Waker


I'll go:

BREATH OF THE WILD over Legend of Zelda

Mad respect for the OG game that started it all. (In many ways, these two games are more similar than any other two Zelda games, in spirit.) But, it's that thing of just outside nostalgia, the original game just doesn't play super well today. It's just from a different era of video games, really, but I'm glad to be where we are. Lots of respect for TLoZ, but BotW is gonna get it hands down.

A LINK TO THE PAST over Link's Awakening

Uuuuugh. This is the one I struggle with the most. I think if the question were "favorite Zelda game," I'd have an easier time because I *definitely* had more fun with Link's Awakening. But that's not the question. Which is the better Zelda game? It's a Link to the Past. To be sure, LA also built off the groundwork from ALttP, and these are also pretty similar games in many ways. But I also have to acknowledge that my love of LA comes mostly from the Switch remake, and that feels a li'l unfair. Meanwhile, ALttP is still fun and great to play in its original form. So I'll go Link to the Past here.

OCARINA OF TIME over Majora's Mask

Well, I didn't necessarily expect all the Zeldas that in my mind are closely related to match up in the second round, but here we are. I think there's been a li'l pushback to Ocarina in recent years just because it's been long heralded as one of the greatest and most influential games of all time. But I also think it's been considered that for good reason. Neither of these games plays suuuuuper great by modern standards, but actually do control fairly well considering. Ocarina is a simpler game by comparison, and I think there's a lot more to talk about with Majora, but when push comes to shove, from start to finish, Ocarina really is the more complete game.

TWILIGHT PRINCESS over WIND WAKER

Honestly feel like I'd probably think more of Wind Waker if I hadn't played the original game. From what I've heard, one of my biggest gripes with the game is practically fixed completely in the HD remaster for Wii-U. (That being the hooooorrible final stretch wherein you have to sail around looking for 8 tri-force pieces [because prefixes have no meaning in Japan, I guess?], but also you have to find 8 maps first, but also you have to get all 8 maps translated, but also you have to collect like, 5,000 rupees to translate them - it's a teeeeeeeedious grind that is pretty much never actually fun.]) Twilight Princess, in my mind, does have one of the weaker and slower starting points of a Zelda game, but it doesn't take too too long to turn it around. I think it gets discernibly better once it stops constantly forcing you to play as a wolf (which isn't bad, but wasn't the part of the game I found especially fun, personally). Wind Waker maybe ages a little better with its distinct cel-shaded style, but Twilight Princess actually looks pretty ok today, too!


How are you voting?

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

Semi-finals, baaaaby.

I'm gonna go:

LINK TO THE PAST over Breath of the Wild

I've logged a scary number of hours into BotW given when I actually acquired it. So clearly, I'm enjoying the game overall. And there's a lot about the game I'm continually impressed by, in particular world design. But Link to the Past, to me, is *the* quintessential Zelda game that gets all the elements of a Zelda and balances it out. I don't love everything about it (never gonna be a fan of bosses that can knock you off a ledge), but the game gets the balance of exploration, puzzles, and combat that I look for in a Zelda. It definitely holds up well today.

OCARINA OF TIME over Wind Waker

Gonna be honest: not sure I understand Wind Waker. Everyone I've talked to either loooves it or haaaates it. And I just feel...indifferent. Like it has one of the worst final stretches of any game I think I've ever played! But I think overall it's a solid experience. I don't think the drag of the final quarter makes me hate it, but I also definitely don't love it. Ocarina of Time, though, I can easily understand why it's one of the most influential games.

How are you voting?

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

Finals! Here's how I'm going:

A LINK TO THE PAST over Ocarina of Time

This is so tough! It's certainly true that Ocarina is one of the most influential games, especially for the modern era of video games. But, it's not like a Link to the Past wasn't influential in its own right. I think the thing that sells me on A Link to the Past as the better Zelda game is primarily that I think it's ultimately aged better. Granted, I don't have access to any of the remastered games, but I played both of these games last summer and it's just the early 3D nature of Ocarina that makes it kiiinda clunky to play, whereas the old school 2D sprites of LttP plays pretty consistently. And it's fun! Ocarina I feel like as a player in the modern age, you wind up fighting the camera a bunch, and the lock-on function is pretty awkward at times. It's still more playable than you'd expect a game from the last '90s to be! But it's definitely dated more than the Super Nintendo game, which I think kinda speaks to the greatness of the SNES, to be honest.


Unrelated, can someone explain to me the appeal of Wind Waker besides the art style? I see it came within one vote of Ocarina of Time in the semi-finals, and Wind Waker is really *the* Zelda game that I don't really get. In either direction, really. I don't see why people love it (and I don't see why people hate it, since I hear both a lot). If you're someone who loves Wind Waker, why do you love it? I'm curious.

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

BoTW for the win. I've never played an open world game period that felt so involved and incredible. Even GTA's open world gets boring after a while. I really felt Twilight Princess should have won over Wind Waker, I mean, having to change the wind direction was annoying, and the dungeons in WW aren't as good as TP... IMO. It was a product of its time, dealing with limitations. I think people have a fondness for WW through nostalgia goggles (and the music was awesome), but TP is structured way better. I played TP first, WW second, so, that's how I feel.

But BoTW hands down is awesome. You haven't even done the story, you don't even have the champion's abilities, you're deliberately not doing the things that make the game fun... so I think you're being unfair to judge it at all.

As for the art style in WW, if you compare the blurry, ugly graphics of the PS2/Gamecube era and look at Wind Waker, well, Wind Waker doesn't look ugly. In the same sense that Paper Mario is the best looking N64 game, Wind Waker was the best looking Gamecube game. Clean colors, clean cel shading, clear expressions, a very tropical atmosphere, and no blurry textures or crappy graphics coming in the way. I personally think it's too simple. The HD remake did a better job making it feel more lively, but a fully opaque ocean is always going to look funky to me. I very much prefer the style of Super Mario Galaxy.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

so I think you're being unfair to judge it at all.

lol

3 Weeks ago
S.O.H.
 

Or, you know, I could just judge GTA at the bottom because I always get bored after driving around for 10 minutes and never actually played the story.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

GTA would probably rightfully be at the bottom of any "Best Zelda" bracket.

3 Weeks ago
Count Dooku
 

No, the bottom of best open world franchise. GTA is at the bottom. Because I never played the story, and I think the game lacks depth.

Even I'm aware of the problems here.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

Because I never played the story, and I think the game lacks depth.

If you're 20+ hours into GTA and you think it lacks depth, that's probably a valid opinion that should be respected ;^)

3 Weeks ago
Count Dooku
 

Unrelated, can someone explain to me the appeal of Wind Waker besides the art style?


The weapons in Wind Waker don't break every ten seconds.

But seriously though, Wind Waker felt a little more open-world-y than OoT, and a lot of that world terrified me (I used to have a huge deep water phobia), so it was a powerful experience. There are probably a lot of other things about the experience that made it for me, including stuff like the cool combat parries, the sound design, having the most platonically wholesome waifus, etc. I haven't played it in years, so I don't have it fresh in my mind.

GTA


I don't know why we're talking about GTA, because it doesn't provide a good comparison to BotW. Hell, the Elder Scrolls doesn't even provide a good comparison to BotW. BotW is still very much a Zelda game, and even if I like Morrowind/Oblivion and San Andreas more than my favorite Zelda games, I'm not going to say that Zelda games are worse.

There is literally no way that GTA is at the bottom of a bracket of every open-world game franchise in anything but the most overbearingly subjective terms. That idea is so fucking ridiculous that there is literally no way for you to convince me of that. That is just wrong, and I don't care what you have to say about it.

3 Weeks ago
CZM
 

If you're 20+ hours into GTA and you think it lacks depth, that's probably a valid opinion that should be respected ;^)

...I'm just saying I'm not the right person to make that call. I didn't play the game, I didn't even research the main story works at all, I know it's there, but I can't provide any good opinion on it. Jet Presto is judging Breath of The Wild, complaining there's no bosses, complaining there's no dungeons, complaining climbing is difficult, and he hasn't done anything in the story. Just got off the Plateau and started running around aimlessly searching for shrines. Nevermind some quests don't appear until after you complete the story for that area...

I've been telling Jet to play the main story for weeks, but for weeks he keeps complaining about things that wouldn't be an issue if he played the main story. And now he's making the same complaints while trying to put it in a bracket for best Zelda.

Technically I've played GTA more than 20 hours in short bursts over many years, but not through the story, so my opinion can't really matter that much.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

S.O.H, you misread literally everything I post. All the time. Always.

Jet is judging BoTW without playing the story. I'm saying he can't judge it without playing the story. You made fun of me for having that opinion. I say it's as ridiculous as me judging GTA without playing the story. You think I'm actually judging GTA and get upset.

Please... take your time. Read. Ask questions, don't assume.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

I've been telling Jet to play the main story for weeks, but for weeks he keeps complaining about things that wouldn't be an issue if he played the main story. And now he's making the same complaints while trying to put it in a bracket for best Zelda.

You can literally walk from the plateau to Hyrule Castle and beat the game in an hour. The "main story" is entirely, 100% optional, by design.

Jet is not playing the game 'wrong'. The developers gave the player the option of -not- doing story missions. If Jet wants to wander the world doing shrines and climbing towers, then go kill Ganon, that's his choice.

Moreover, he's played the game long enough to know if he cares for the game mechanically. Yes, he doesn't have a couple of useful abilities. But none of them are really 'game changers'. If he doesn't like the durability system, that's not going to change. If he doesn't like how much time you spend navigating menus, that's not going to change.

I know you think your opinion on this game is just invaluable to human civilization, but maybe step off a little bit. People don't have to enjoy games the exact same way you do. People are allowed to have differing opinions.

3 Weeks ago
Count Dooku
 

Jet is not playing the game 'wrong'. The developers gave the player the option of -not- doing story missions. If Jet wants to wander the world doing shrines and climbing towers, then go kill Ganon, that's his choice.

Fine. But when he complains there's no bosses, no dungeons, it's too difficult to climb, lightning is a problem, fighting a bunch of enemies is difficult, Boko weapons break easy, etc, all of these are addressed when you play through the main story and get the Master Sword. The problems he's running into now are mainly from his own decisions, and he's not taking anyone's advice to make it easier. Imagine what would happen if he goes into the Ganon fight without knowing how to cook a truffle or beating any of the divine beasts or gaining any of the champions abilities or weapons, or even any royal weapons, or upgraded armor. He'll complain about why he has to face 7 boss fights and all his weapons break and he loses all his health so easily.

It's just not an informed opinion. He still has a lot to figure out, and he hasn't done any of the main story, yet. The game was designed so even if you're faced with something difficult, you're supposed to figure out how to overcome it, even if that means going back, getting better armor, food, weapons, etc. and come back later. Jet just complains the game's difficult and that's that.

Moreover, he's played the game long enough to know if he cares for the game mechanically. Yes, he doesn't have a couple of useful abilities. But none of them are really 'game changers'. If he doesn't like the durability system, that's not going to change. If he doesn't like how much time you spend navigating menus, that's not going to change.

You don't think the Master Sword, Revali's Gale, Urbosa's Fury, the Thunder Helm, and maybe learning how to cook attack boosts and get stronger armor might alleviate some of his concerns?

I know you think your opinion on this game is just invaluable to human civilization, but maybe step off a little bit. People don't have to enjoy games the exact same way you do. People are allowed to have differing opinions.

OK, fine. I think GTA is shallow, gets boring after 10 minutes, it's the worst game ever made, there isn't even a story, I can't change my character, and it won't even give me a gun. That's not a valid opinion, it's all lies! I always play GTA with a friend and we just run around stealing cars before we get bored of it. But maybe I'm not the best person to criticize GTA. Maybe I need to learn something about the story and... you know, the gameplay itself, for my opinion to actually mean something. Someone who's played through Zelda's story won't complain about not having dungeons or bosses.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

But when he complains there's no bosses, no dungeons, it's too difficult to climb, lightning is a problem, fighting a bunch of enemies is difficult, Boko weapons break easy, etc, all of these are addressed when you play through the main story and get the Master Sword.

It's honestly kind of astounding how this is all you managed to take away from everything Jet has written on the subject. Some of which you seem to have invented out of thin air.

Jet just complains the game's difficult and that's that.

Again, definitely not what he's doing, or he probably would have put the game down several dozen hours ago. Maybe you'd understand this if you weren't so busy talking AT him, rather than to him.

You don't think the Master Sword, Revali's Gale, Urbosa's Fury, the Thunder Helm, and maybe learning how to cook attack boosts and get stronger armor might alleviate some of his concerns?

They don't fix some of the fundamental design issues at work in the game, so no. Most of them are situationally useful tools to have in your belt, but they are ultimately optional. Again, by design.

Maybe instead of blaming Jet, you should direct your ire at Nintendo for not railroading him onto the "right path".

That's not a valid opinion, it's all lies!

For the last time, this is not what Jet is doing.

Maybe I need to learn something about the story

"The story" is less prevalent in this game than in any previous Zelda title. You can miss 95% of it by choice, and even if you do watch it you're still left with Dark Souls-sized holes that you have to fill with your own headcanon. It's nothing spectacular, and is fundamentally unlikely to change anyone's opinion on the game.

Moreover, the Divine Beasts are poor stand-ins for dungeons. I made it to the boss fight in Vah Rudania in less than 20 minutes, and that was because I was in a hurry to start dinner. It's almost impossible to die in them until the 'boss', and in all 4 cases the 'boss' barely has anything that passes for mechanics. You hit them with your strongest stick until they die. Truly exhilarating.

3 Weeks ago
Count Dooku
 

But seriously though, Wind Waker felt a little more open-world-y than OoT


That's fair. There's no question WW is a larger world, for sure. If I'm honest, I didn't personally think the open worldness felt particularly different in that regards. I think it was because WW is "physically" so large, but because it's just a big sea. Like the world is bigger, but it's like 90% just open water. Which made the world feel ultimately not that much bigger than OoT to me.

But I also do see that all the different islands made it feel like there were ultimately more locations. To be clear, by no means do I think Wind Waker is at all bad. I enjoyed it (until the last few hours). It's just funny because it's the game I heard like, the biggest divide in the fans over, with half the people I know loving it and half hating it. And I played it and was like, "Yeah, this is fine." (Shrug).


GTA would probably rightfully be at the bottom of any "Best Zelda" bracket.


I'd probably put it above Skyward Sword, though!

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

so I think you're being unfair to judge it at all.


Soooo....after aaaaaaall our fights over The Last of Us, a game you never played when we argued about it, do you, uh, maybe see a liiiiiiittle hypocrisy here?

I've played more of Breath of the Wild before speaking about it than you ever played of The Last of Us before speaking about that.

But when he complains there's no bosses, no dungeons, it's too difficult to climb, lightning is a problem, fighting a bunch of enemies is difficult, Boko weapons break easy, etc, all of these are addressed when you play through the main story and get the Master Sword.


Literally only the weapon durability issue - which I am far from the only one to complain about - is legit. The rest you're being completely, arrogantly dismissive of what my *actual* criticism was. You're constantly either deliberately lying because you're a piece of shit, or you could really stand to actually try reading things sometimes. If this is what you think my thoughts on the game so far have been, you literally are not even remotely as smart as you think you are.

I've been telling Jet to play the main story for weeks, but for weeks he keeps complaining about things that wouldn't be an issue if he played the main story. And now he's making the same complaints while trying to put it in a bracket for best Zelda.


And I've been telling you for weeks that I *have* been doing the story, but that I don't *only* do the story. Because this game is *clearly* not designed for you to just go from story quest to story quest and that's that. And not for nothing, I have not made *any* of those criticisms here in this post. I literally voted for BotW in every match-up it was in *except* when it went up against Link to the Past, which I think is a better Zelda game. I don't need to log 100+ hours to recognize that Link to the Past balances elements of a Zelda game in a way I find better than BotW.

And bud, if you're too emotional and not in a mentally sound enough place to participate in these conversations, you don't have to. You literally could have responded to this thread with explaining how you were voting and why. And instead of choosing to do that, you instead chose to once again just make shit up and sound like a hypocrite and an idiot. If you wanted to talk about why you love BotW, this was your chance. And instead, you chose to attack me for your deliberate misconceptions of how you think I'm playing the game. Why? Why are you putting SO MUCH STOCK in how I personally feel about this game? (A game that would have probably made it to the finals for me, provided it didn't run into Link's Awakening or Link to the Past.)

Thanks for ruining yet another of my threads, dude. Well done.

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

They don't fix some of the fundamental design issues at work in the game, so no. Most of them are situationally useful tools to have in your belt, but they are ultimately optional. Again, by design.

But they do. You're telling me an armor that boosts ancient weapon damage by 80%, a weapon that does 60 damage in one hit, a meal that boosts all damage 50%, the ability to spin it to make rapid hits, and the ability to do 500 damage instantly won't do anything to improve weapon durability, or how long it takes to fight a Guardian? The same weapon can do 60 damage or 162 damage depending on what you're wearing and what food you're eating. It can take a second to swing and do 60 damage, or you can completely kill a guardian in the same amount of time. It can take 100 hits from poor weapons, 25 hits from the ancient axe ++, or just 5 hits with the right strategy.

If you don't use any strategy whatsoever and complain about weapons breaking, you don't go through the main story and complain there's no bosses, complain about how difficult it is to climb the mountains in Faron Woods without any climbing gear, speed modifiers, or Revali's gale, and complain about not knowing how to cook when the game repeatedly tells you and shows you how to cook, I mean, this kind of paints a picture, doesn't it? Jet is playing BoTW the same way I play GTA and trying to make a judgement call. In the beginning he kept comparing BoTW to Dark Souls, but it sounded like he knew a lot more about how Dark Souls' systems worked than BoTW. I just saw a playthrough where some guy spent hours trying to figure out how to survive Mount Hylia without any cooking, and he literally had no clue what he was doing. He mashed through all the dialogue and didn't read anything. The old man told him how to chop down a tree, and he spent a while because he didn't read it. Jet is having even more issues than this guy did.

For the last time, this is not what Jet is doing.

O rly? So his complaint there aren't any bosses is completely valid, I guess.

Moreover, the Divine Beasts are poor stand-ins for dungeons. I made it to the boss fight in Vah Rudania in less than 20 minutes, and that was because I was in a hurry to start dinner. It's almost impossible to die in them until the 'boss', and in all 4 cases the 'boss' barely has anything that passes for mechanics. You hit them with your strongest stick until they die. Truly exhilarating.

Better than most of TPs bosses, that's for sure. Thunderblight was interesting, using the electricity against itself. And Waterblight was interesting to me... I think that was the most difficult, no? Rudania/Fireblight almost feels purposefully easy. It didn't attack and just left itself open, as you said, beat with stick until dead. It seemed weakened somehow. According to the story, the Gorons kept on fighting it and driving it up the mountain. It's hard for me to justify a pathetically easy boss, though. Coupled with the fact that you are a bit stronger when you get there, it makes sense.

Do Lynels count as boss fights, or are they just really strong, really good miniboss fights? I felt the Lynel battles were way more fun than any of the bosses.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

S.O.H, you misread literally everything I post. All the time. Always.

I mean you had a meltdown over The Last of Us without even playing the game. So yes. I do think your comment is hilarious.

You also dont bother to read what people have posted and put words in their mouth.

3 Weeks ago
S.O.H.
 

HA! Rich.

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

You're constantly either deliberately lying because you're a piece of shit, or you could really stand to actually try reading things sometimes. If this is what you think my thoughts on the game so far have been, you literally are not even remotely as smart as you think you are.


Yeah, it's really hard to get anywhere with him when he will literally lie to my own face about what I just said. Doesn't really constitute any sort of legitimate dialogue.

3 Weeks ago
CZM
 

Soooo....after aaaaaaall our fights over The Last of Us, a game you never played when we argued about it, do you, uh, maybe see a liiiiiiittle hypocrisy here?

Since my comments were all about the problems inherent to a linear experience and the entire game was a linear experience, no. Any game with a linear experience is not going to feel like you can travel anywhere, you are forced to go forward the way it wants you to go forward. But your comments about Zelda can only make sense if you deliberately ignore the entire game, don't read anything, don't attempt any strategy, don't play the main story, and criticize it for not holding your hand, but also praise it for not holding your hand. Your criticisms are all addressed if you do what characters tell you to do and learn more about the world and take advantage. Is there a backtracking, sidequest, adventure option in TLoU I don't know about? My criticisms still stand. Playing through a linear story, your hand is forced. In Breath of The Wild, I can decide at any moment to go somewhere and do something else. And the thing I'm doing has real actual gameplay value: find parts to upgrade armor, hunt for korok seeds to expand slots, you can sell the stuff you forage, you can register the horses you ride, mine gems to sell, find shrines, upgrade inventory, etc.

And I've been telling you for weeks that I *have* been doing the story, but that I don't *only* do the story. Because this game is *clearly* not designed for you to just go from story quest to story quest and that's that. And not for nothing, I have not made *any* of those criticisms here in this post.

I asked how many blights you defeated and have not heard a response. I asked how many divine beats you've been through and haven't heard a response. You have Revali's gale and complain about climbing? You have Urbosa's Fury and the Master Sword and complain about weapon durability? You've beaten all the divine beasts and boss fights and complain there aren't any dungeons or bosses? Based on your comments it really just seems like you're not playing the main story and complaining about not having the stuff you get from it. I know playing BoTW that I will get stronger from the main quest, so I'm aware when I decide not to do that I'm putting a pause on getting more abilites/better weapons in order to do something else.

Why? Why are you putting SO MUCH STOCK in how I personally feel about this game?

Because it's really painful to look at someone playing golf with a bowling ball and complain they can't win.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

Your criticisms are all addressed if you do what characters tell you to do and learn more about the world and take advantage.


First off, no they're not all addressed. But second of all, you don't see any contradiction in criticizing linear games for "holding your hand," then telling me that I'll enjoy this open world exploration-driven game if I just...do what the game explicitly tells me to do?

You're literally telling me to play the game like it's a linear game, then criticizing me when I don't, then tell me that Breath of the Wild is so great because you can do something else or go somewhere else when you don't.

You literally sound like our government during the pandemic. "Don't go out! But if you want to, that's fine. But you shouldn't. But you can. But don't. But support local businesses, so go out. But not too much. Stay home. But go to work."

"Do what the game tells you to do! But also it's great because you can do something else if you want. But don't do something else, because that's wrong. But the game is great because you *could* do something else if you want. But you shouldn't do something else if you want. But it's great because you can if you want to. But you shouldn't want to. Greatest game ever. Total perfection."


Because it's really painful to look at someone playing golf with a bowling ball and complain they can't win.


Again, this was a thread that was literally meant for everyone to talk about what *they* liked about the Zelda games in this bracket. You chose not to do that, instead opting to continue to unreasonably and disingenuously attack me for how you perceive me playing a game you have nothing to do with, form a DIFFERENT thread. You literally could have just used this opportunity to talk about what YOU like about Zelda. And you couldn't even do that.

I don't know if just something's going on, but holy shit dude, you wanna talk about "painful to look at" something, I sincerely hope you get the help you need. I don't know what's going on, but I hope you get it.

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

But BoTW hands down is awesome. You haven't even done the story, you don't even have the champion's abilities, you're deliberately not doing the things that make the game fun... so I think you're being unfair to judge it at all.

Why are you derailing this thread in the first place? This is about your opinions on the best Zelda or which you really enjoyed and for what reasons.

3 Weeks ago
Fox Forever
 

(Your first post was fine, by the way. I don't know why you couldn't have just stuck with that. I literally didn't say a single negative thing about Breath of the Wild in this thread. All I did was voted for Link to the Past over it because, for me, it's a more complete and balanced Zelda experience. That's it. That's all I did to incur your ire here. That's *all* it took for you to then lash out unreasonably and carry over shit from a different thread that has nothing to do with this one.)

3 Weeks ago
Jet Presto
 

I enjoyed BoTW's combat system because it really made me think. I couldn't just bash all my weapons against enemies forever because they'd break. That forced me to think outside the box about how to take them down. Turns out bows are incredibly powerful. Turns out elementals are incredibly powerful. Turns out food is incredibly powerful. There are so many ways to approach a fight it's unbelievable. Combining the right armor with weapons to get the best possible advantage, it's a combat system unlike any I've seen before.

The game gives you a massive world to explore and great reason to explore every inch of it. You find have to find rare parts to upgrade armor, battle some fantastic fights, and on the way to anything you want to do there are a dozen other things you will end up doing, even when you least expect it. It's not a dead world, the world is teeming with life.

While other Zeldas were quite oppressively linear, or kept the exploration very limited in scope, Breath of the Wild is the peak of what an open world can accomplish. You can start and stop the main story naturally at will, simply by doing whatever you want to do when you want to do it. And you can travel anywhere you've been in an instant. It's the most adult-proof Zelda I've ever played - the list of sidequests has come in handy, and the map is neither oppressively burdened with icons like Ubisoft nor incredibly simplistic like past Zeldas.

Everything just seems great. The puzzles are extraordinary. The presentation from beginning to end is top-notch. The Divine beasts are very clever, and unlike other dungeons there's no prescribed solution. Any solution that works is perfectly accepted. The game encourages emergent gameplay and experimentation, and does it seamlessly. If you go looking for flaws you can find some - The game is so open and the handholding so... nonexistent, it's unlikely anyone can play it without getting stuck. Some of the bosses are terribly easy. And the Lynel fights are incredibly not, until you figure out the tricks. The game demands a lot more from you than others to find unorthodox solutions before proceeding. For instance, shooting a Lynel in the face to stop it in its tracks. But what might seem like an unusual solution to some comes naturally to others. But it's hard for me to find a more handsomely produced effort. In control, in presentation, in music, in sound effects, in game mechanics, in combat, in exploration, in motivation, in playing the story, in not playing the story, in the prologue, in the post game, etc. etc, this is the open world that I've been wanting to see for decades. It does end at some point, after you upgrade all your armor, find all the shrines, and can't be bothered to look for any more Korok seeds. But even after beating it, you feel as though you didn't just play a game, but had a real life experience that you can actually consider your own. It got me to fall in love with games all over again. It's one of my favorite games of all time.

3 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

you can't spell booty without oot

2 Weeks ago
The Bandit
 

Mguy, how many open-world adventure/RPGs have you played?

2 Weeks ago
CZM
 

Not much. I tried a tiny bit of Assassin's Creed, but the menu was kind of complicated, and I didn't quite get it. Also Oblivion, but it just seemed complicated and not well polished. Not making a judgement call, though, just what I picked up playing it. I play GTA exclusively "grab a car and do whatever." I've played Paper Mario and TTYD all the way through, N64 I probably beat 15 times. Also Mario and Luigi, Bowser's Inside Story. I've played some 2D Metroidvania games like Dust and Undertale all the way through. For Zelda, I played Twilight Princess and the Wii U Wind Waker HD remake. Also played Metroid Prime 3: Corruption.

2 Weeks ago
mariomguy
 

Reply to: Best Zelda Bracket

Username
Password