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World & Politics


World events, politics and whatever (especially whatever)
WARNING: Posts may contain offensive content and red wine
09/11/2001 WE REMEMBER
Moderated by: Famov, Arch

"Fear is the foundation of most governments." - John Adams

"Despite the constant negative press covfefe" - Donald Trump


This was released last night and its gotten pretty viral. This isn't the first time Eminem has has criticized a president. He criticized Bush in his song "Mosh" back in 2004.



lyrics:
It’s the calm before the storm right here
Wait, how was I gonna start this off?
I forgot— oh, yeah
That’s an awfully hot coffee pot
Should I drop it on Donald Trump? Probably not
But that’s all I got ’til I come up with a solid plot
Got a plan and now I gotta hatch it
Like a damn Apache with a tomahawk
Imma walk inside a mosque on Ramadan
And say a prayer that every time Melania talks
She gets a mou— Ahh, Imma stop
But we better give Obama props
‘Cause what we got in office now’s a kamikaze
That’ll probably cause a nuclear holocaust
And while the drama pops
And he waits for s— to quiet down, he’ll just gas his plane up and fly around ’til the bombing stops
Intensities heightened, tensions are risin’
Trump, when it comes to giving a s—, you’re stingy as I am
Except when it comes to having the balls to go against me, you hide ’em
‘Cause you don’t got the f—ing nuts, like an empty asylum
Racism’s the only thing he’s fantastic for
‘Cause that’s how he gets his f—ing rocks off and he’s orange
Yeah, sick tan
That’s why he wants us to disband
‘Cause he cannot withstand
The fact we’re not afraid of Trump
F— walkin’ on egg shells, I came to stomp
That’s why he keeps screamin’ ‘Drain the swamp’
‘Cause he’s in quicksand
It’s like we take a step forwards, then backwards
But this is his form of distraction
Plus, he gets an enormous reaction
When he attacks the NFL so we focus on that
Instead of talking Puerto Rico or gun reform for Nevada
All these horrible tragedies and he’s bored and would rather
Cause a Twitter storm with the Packers
Then says he wants to lower our taxes
Then who’s gonna pay for his extravagant trips
Back and forth with his fam to his golf resorts and his mansions?
Same s— that he tormented Hillary for and he slandered
Then does it more
From his endorsement of Bannon
Support for the Klansmen
Tiki torches in hand for the soldier that’s black
And comes home from Iraq
And is still told to go back to Africa
Fork and a dagger in this racist 94-year-old grandpa
Who keeps ignoring our past historical, deplorable factors
Now if you’re a black athlete, you’re a spoiled little brat for
Tryna use your platform or your stature
To try to give those a voice who don’t have one
He says, ‘You’re spittin’ in the face of vets who fought for us, you bastards!’
Unless you’re a POW who’s tortured and battered
‘Cause to him you’re zeros
‘Cause he don’t like his war heroes captured
That’s not disrespecting the military
F— that! This is for Colin, ball up a fist!
And keep that s— balled like Donald the bitch!
‘He’s gonna get rid of all immigrants!’
‘He’s gonna build that thang up taller than this!’
Well, if he does build it, I hope it’s rock solid with bricks
‘Cause like him in politics, I’m using all of his tricks
‘Cause I’m throwin’ that piece of s— against the wall ’til it sticks
And any fan of mine who’s a supporter of his
I’m drawing in the sand a line: you’re either for or against
And if you can’t decide who you like more and you’re split
On who you should stand beside, I’ll do it for you with this:
F— you!
The rest of America, stand up
We love our military, and we love our country
But we f—ing hate Trump




thoughts? He clearly gives an ultimatum to fans to chose between him and Trump.

P.S. eminem looks weird with facial hair



settingsOptions
There are 140 Replies

Can't wait for people to.call him a dead beat talentless rapper.


He looks weird in that video not sure if it's the lighting.

Posted October 12th by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

Don't think the WH has responded yet. I'm sure Trump will say something on his twitter.

Yeah, I'm just not used to him with facial hair.

Posted October 12th by ShadowFox08
ShadowFox08

You honestly think Trump would waste his time on this guy when he hasn't bothered with anyone more relevant?

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

its trump. so yes.

Posted October 12th by S.O.H.
S.O.H.
 

You honestly think Trump would waste his time on this guy when he hasn't bothered with anyone more relevant?


He's coming out of a tiff with the NFL over football players kneeling instead of standing for the anthem and he has a running policy of shitting on network news anytime they say something negative about him. I wouldn't be surprised if I found Donald Trump responding to terrible YouTube comments about him at some point.

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

I wouldn't be surprised if I found Donald Trump responding to terrible YouTube comments about him at some point.

I thought we had so much work to be done to fix this country. guess I was wrong.




Posted October 12th by s.o.h.
s.o.h.
 

You honestly think Trump would waste his time on this guy when he hasn't bothered with anyone more relevant?

Yes. He has attacked kapernick recently for the national anthem kneeling, and spends half of his time everyday thinking about what to tweet next instead of doing his job and acting like a decent human being.

Posted October 12th by ShadowFox08
ShadowFox08

Yes. He has attacked kapernick recently for the national anthem kneeling, and spends half of his time everyday thinking about what to tweet next instead of doing his job and acting like a decent human being.


He's coming out of a tiff with the NFL over football players kneeling instead of standing for the anthem


Role models. It's no different from when the vile left decides to go after pewdiepie, jon tron, and a number of things over the most asenine reasons. It's the same reason why conservatives in the entertainment industry call it "coming out of the closet" when the commit occupational suicide by admitting they aren't SJWs. Poor Taylor Swift has been target of a witch hunt, regardless of the fact no one even knows what she believes. People are afraid that X will believe something or take up some stance because Y is a role model and that their position will be enough to motivate and convince people. It's for the same reason that Donald Trump condemns the football players that the football players do it. Yet, somehow, we call this petty, when what's actually petty is that people actually consider one's social status before the logical arguments.

and he has a running policy of shitting on network news anytime they say something negative about him. I wouldn't be surprised if I found Donald Trump responding to terrible YouTube comments about him at some point.


People actually believe the mainstream media, so i don't blame him, there.



Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

The argument was not about wether or not it was petty or unjustified. You asked if Trump would waste his time when he hasn't bothered otherwise...well, he has bothered.

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

The argument was not about wether or not it was petty or unjustified. You asked if Trump would waste his time when he hasn't bothered otherwise...well, he has bothered.


Right. The weight matters. Eminem is barely even relevant anymore. Honestly, i feel this more of a publicity stunt of his than anything, hoping he can cash in on the Trump hysteria to make up for his falling career, just like Fonzie jumped over the shark to try to get some fans back.

It's possible Trump would bother, but i would hope not. He's got more important things to be doing right now.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Right. The weight matters. Eminem is barely even relevant anymore. Honestly, i feel this more of a publicity stunt of his than anything, hoping he can cash in on the Trump hysteria to make up for his falling career, just like Fonzie jumped over the shark to try to get some fans back.


Eminem is the highest-selling rapper of all time. Literally every one of his commercial albums, even the more recent divisive ones, have gone platinum. He's not as big as he once was, but it's not like he's jumping the shark in any sense.

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

It's no different from when the vile left decides to go after pewdiepie, jon tron, and a number of things over the most asenine reasons.

Fuck pewdiepie. Dude says stupid shit, apologies, and keeps going back on it. He has said anti semitism comments, and casually called someone a nigger 2-3x in a livechat video on a shooter game. I don't support internet vigilantism, since I do think it goes a bit far at times, but he deserves to get his sponsorship stripped. He's the last person to be called a role model.

It's for the same reason that Donald Trump condemns the football players that the football players do it. Yet, somehow, we call this petty, when what's actually petty is that people actually consider one's social status before the logical arguments.
Because him and everyone else who seriously thinks kneeling when people sing the national anthem is disrespectful to soldiers, is ignorant. First of all, he's kneeling to protest against police brutality against minorities, not against disrespecting soldiers. Secondly national anthem was never a thing in football or any other sport, until recently. the U.S. government added it to NFL games in the late 2000s to advertise people to join the military. And last, the national anthem was created was racist against blacks and pro slavery. Those parts were cut out of being sung in the sports games we know today, but it just makes you think the fuck we're singing such a song in the first place in 2017.

The jingoism is fucking laughable in this country. According to the u.s. constitution, you aren't supposed to deface or wear the flag, or else its "disrespectful" and we do it all the time.. including kid rock who wears a flag and is running for a political position for the republican party.. Or how about a president who dodged the draft more than once cause his daddy has the money to do so, and who pretends he cares for vets, but doesn't give a shit about them if they're dead or held hostage.

This whole cult flag + national anthem worshiping thing is beyond idiotic, just like the pledge of allegiance that was forced down our throat as kids without question.. It's just another way for the government to distract and control us from the things that really matter, while they do their dirty work and spending copous amounts on the military on how to conquer and kill other people, while setting us up to divides us from each other if we disagree or question them.

Its shit like this that makes me wonder why I should feel proud to be American. I don't feel proud for the shit my country has done, like brainwashing millions into jingosim. continuing unnecessary wars and killing thousands and displacing millions more in the process. It's our goverments that created terrorism. Hell, I feel the most patriotic, when I stand up against my government for when they do stupid shit like this, as well as the government constantly surveillance us, or being locked to a stupid two party system that the rich clearly controls both sides.. and having a dumb ass as a president who only cares about himself and giving tax cuts to him and his rich pals. Trump is far from being a role model, and he will NEVER EVER understand what it is to be a regular working or middle class american. No man born rich and with an ugly personality like him will ever understand.

Edited October 12th by ShadowFox08
ShadowFox08

Eminem is barely even relevant anymore. Honestly, i feel this more of a publicity stunt of his than anything, hoping he can cash in on the Trump hysteria to make up for his falling career, just like Fonzie jumped over the shark to try to get some fans back.

What the fuck. Hes one of the greatest rap artist of all time. His career isnt failing lol. It seems to me that you know nothing of the guy.

The last time he left the music scene he wanted to focus on his family, specifically his daughters.

Hes the highest selling artist of the last decade and has been called the king of hip hop. How exactly is his career failing?\

publicity stunt

Eminem could have released an album last month and it would have easily gone platinum. He doesnt need the publicity theres a reason why hes been away from the lime light. And having a "failing career" is not it.

Posted October 12th by S.O.H.
S.O.H.
 

Sounds to me more like fanboy than objectivity. This post is the first i've heard of the guy in a very, very long time. He's not relevant anymore.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Sounds to me more like fanboy than objectivity.


And yet the sales numbers and platinum certifications prove that it is, indeed, objective.

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

Elvis has some, too, but they're not recent, so not relevant.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

This post is the first i've heard of the guy in a very, very long time.

thats what happens when people leave the industry to focus on their families. shocking right.

He wasnt doing it to be relevant though. He doesnt need the extra spotlight. Eminem is still a house hold name. Now if it were some one like X Zibit, T pain, Lil Wayne, Nelly, Akon or even 50 cent I could understand. But Eminem? really?

Once again how is his career failing exactly?

I am really starting to think this guy is red leaf on another alt account.



Edited October 12th by s.o.h.
s.o.h.
 

If he's not currently relevant, he's a falling star. That's how stardom works. You have momentum at all times. You're either going up or down. Very rarely do you bounce.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Elvis has some, too, but they're not recent, so not relevant.


Yes, I agree that Elvis is not as relevant as Eminem.


Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

Indeed, Elvis' name has been going around more often than his, lately.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

he's a falling star.

Id argue that in order to be a falling star some one would have to have surpassed you. I dont keep up with the rap scene much these days but you wont be able to find a better or more popular mainstream rapper than Eminem.


how much time needs to pass before an artist or individual stops being relevant? His last album was selling like hotcakes in 2014. a few months after its initial release it even won a grammy in 2015 for best rap album.

2 and a half years have passed since then..

Posted October 12th by S.O.H.
S.O.H.
 

Rhianna seems to be more popular, which is incredibly sad to say. I don't hear much of Rap, anymore, which makes me happy. It shows me that pop and country are becoming more popular again, which is a good thing in some ways, bad in others. I'd much rather have something a little more artistic, but at least it's musical.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Is Rhianna a rapper though?

Posted October 12th by S.O.H.
S.O.H.
 

from the few things i've heard from her, i wouldn't exactly call that singing. So yes, i would call her one.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Except she isn't though. You would have a point if I had said mainstream artist but I specifically said rapper. She isn't one she's primarily a pop/ contemporary r and b singer.

Posted October 12th by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

I wouldn't call her that, but if you say so.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Indeed, Elvis' name has been going around more often than his, lately.


Where's that?

It shows me that pop and country are becoming more popular again


Pop is not a genre. There is a vague melange of styles that has come to be known as "pop", but the term itself means nothing definite in a music sense. Over the last few decades, hip-hop/rap has established itself as the leading pop style over rock.

I'd much rather have something a little more artistic, but at least it's musical.


How is country and whatever "pop" is supposed to be "musical" in supposed contrast to rap?

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

Where's that?


The mouths of people.

Pop is not a genre. There is a vague melange of styles that has come to be known as "pop", but the term itself means nothing definite in a music sense. Over the last few decades, hip-hop/rap has established itself as the leading pop style over rock.


I'll concede that one.

How is country and whatever "pop" is supposed to be "musical" in supposed contrast to rap?


Pitch ranges that exceed those of normal speech ranges.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Mouths of people

Doesn't that depend on the people you hang out with? I'm sure the king of rock comes up more often around older circles than the king of rap. Aren't you from the rural east? I would find it shocking for rap to take root out side of major eastern cities.

Also isn't Elvis far more symbolic in general? I mean I can only think of two other American artists who have that level of symbolism. One of them is Micheal Jackson and the other being maybe Tupac?

Mj and Elvis shook up the industry and made it largely their own. I think it's too early to judge wether Eminem left that big of an impact on the music industry considering he isn't dead and is now coming out of retirement I guess only time will tell.

Edited October 12th by A.o.h.
A.o.h.
 

The mouths of people.


You might as well pull your arguments straight from your butthole.

Pitch ranges that exceed those of normal speech ranges.


Why is that the standard for "musicality" and what do you have that shows that country/"pop" has this while rap doesn't?

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

Doesn't that depend on the people you hang out with? I'm sure the king of rock comes up more often around older circles than the king of rap. Aren't you from the rural east? I would find it shocking for rap to take root out side of major eastern cities.


I'm also a bit of a netizen.

Also isn't Elvis far more symbolic in general? I mean I can only think of two other American artists who have that level of symbolism. One of them is Micheal Jackson and the other being maybe Tupac?


This is true, but this is more for my case than against my case.

Mj and Elvis shook up the industry and made it largely their own. I think it's too early to judge wether Eminem left that big of an impact on the music industry considering he isn't dead and is now coming out of retirement I guess only time will tell.


Perhaps, but given that you historically don't make a comeback, i wouldn't hold your breath.

Why is that the standard for "musicality"


It is the distinction between singing and talking by definition. Otherwise, asian people don't talk, but sing. Just listen to simple counting from 1 to 10 in 関西弁.

and what do you have that shows that country/"pop" has this while rap doesn't?


Ears.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

It is the distinction between singing and talking by definition.


What definition?

Ears.


Can you give me an actual answer?

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

Relevancy isn't the same thing as popularity in the music scene. Kanye for example is maybe less of a household name, but he's definitely more relevant than eminem. To be relevant you have to actually still be in the news half the time, regardless of how your actual albums do.

Posted October 12th by Xhin
Xhin
 

I don't hear much of Rap, anymore, which makes me happy. It shows me that pop and country are becoming more popular again, which is a good thing in some ways, bad in others.

Come here and say that. Atlanta has like 2 country stations, 2 pop stations, and 32948293048 rap/hip-hop stations.

I'd much rather have something a little more artistic, but at least it's musical.

Pitch ranges that exceed those of normal speech ranges.

If you don't like rap just say so.

Posted October 12th by Xhin
Xhin
 

I don't hear much of Rap, anymore, which makes me happy.

Also the internet is somehow even worse. Try finding something in this list that isn't rap:
https://soundcloud.com/charts/top

Posted October 12th by Xhin
Xhin
 

What definition?


Webster, oxford, take your pick.

Can you give me an actual answer?


How is it not appropriate. You asked me how one differentiates the quality mentioned (pitch ranges). This is practically accomplished by using one's ears. It's just like identifying the colors red and green: one simply uses their eyes.

Relevancy isn't the same thing as popularity in the music scene. Kanye for example is maybe less of a household name, but he's definitely more relevant than eminem. To be relevant you have to actually still be in the news half the time, regardless of how your actual albums do.


I wouldn't argue news so much as word of mouth. News itself is heavily regulated and controlled, yet things (other than music) maintain relevancy otherwise. Either way, popularity is a big feature in this, but you are right in that it is not the exclusive determinate.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 


Come here and say that. Atlanta has like 2 country stations, 2 pop stations, and 32948293048 rap/hip-hop stations.


And i'll raise you "Bro-country."

If you don't like rap just say so.


I all but did, which was the point of my remarks. It's important to note, though that it doesn't detract from my other statements.

Also the internet is somehow even worse. Try finding something in this list that isn't rap:
URL HERE


I'll take that, but i'll also point out that saturation of a market doesn't mean the market is doing well. Look at mobile gaming.

EDIT: I think something went boom.

Edited October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

I wouldn't argue news so much as word of mouth. News itself is heavily regulated and controlled, yet things (other than music) maintain relevancy otherwise. Either way, popularity is a big feature in this, but you are right in that it is not the exclusive determinate.

Well yeah that's what I meant. Being a household name is great but it's not the same thing as being "popular" at all. Two very different types of fame, and only the latter one is actually relevant.

And i'll raise you "Bro-country."

That doesn't negate my point. Rap's popularity is definitely a regional thing however. When I lived in Alabama there were zero rap stations and tons of country/rock stations.

It's important to note, though that it doesn't detract from my other statements.

It does when you start defining what "music" is and isn't.

I'll take that, but i'll also point out that saturation of a market doesn't mean the market is doing well. Look at mobile gaming.

How exactly is mobile gaming not doing well?

Posted October 12th by Xhin
Xhin
 

Well yeah that's what I meant. Being a household name is great but it's not the same thing as being "popular" at all. Two very different types of fame, and only the latter one is actually relevant.


This is an important point beyond face value, too. And i think that's very much what the original idea of the topic had to do with (oddly enough, this is tied to the SNES topic): we do have people using their positions of relevance to try to influence peoples' minds. I'd say it's wrong, but if your idea is bad enough, people will judge your idea outside of "well, bieber said it so it must be true." This is what lead to Bieber's downfall: he acted like a total idiot. He thought he was in a position to get away with saying or doing anything from any capacity and it wouldn't have negative effects on his career.

That doesn't negate my point. Rap's popularity is definitely a regional thing however. When I lived in Alabama there were zero rap stations and tons of country/rock stations.


Indeed. The concern really is, how is it overall? From my anecdotal evidence, not very well at all. However, when real stats exist, anecdotal evidence shouldn't be taken too seriously (i do believe that it shouldn't be thrown out completely, though, because it can potentially explain oddities and quirky results that don't fit the experiment derived explanation).

It does when you start defining what "music" is and isn't.


Only if you use a subjective definition. For objective definitions, it does not matter. I like cats, but that doesn't make them guard animals.

How exactly is mobile gaming not doing well?


In the west, sales are decreasing, people are moving away and onto consoles and computer. Mobile gaming, especially the style invading non-mobile games. Ironically, to the point that even Kanye chimed in (more specifically about micro-transactions, and i gained alot more respect for him that day).

But, if you'd like, i could come up with more examples, like TV advertising, which seems to get more saturated the worse it gets (probably because it's not doing well which makes it cheaper which makes it more saturated, but that same reasoning wouldn't actually apply to rap, but it does mobile gaming XD).

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Rhianna seems to be more popular, which is incredibly sad to say. I don't hear much of Rap, anymore, which makes me happy. It shows me that pop and country are becoming more popular again, which is a good thing in some ways, bad in others. I'd much rather have something a little more artistic, but at least it's musical.

The music industry, insofar as what is most popular and mass marketed, is currently saturated with hip hop and its derivatives. Just take a look at the US Billboard 100, or the Spotify Top 50, or any other domestic developed market around the world. This has been the case (i.e. as null says, eclipsing rock-pop and other loose popular genres) for the past 10-15 years at the very least and shows no signs of abating.

Rihanna might not be a rapper in the technical sense, but given contemporary RnB's close relationship with hip hop and how they all move with various trends in a similar fashion and at the same time (for example, the pseudo-dancehall formats that have been popular for the past 2 years in production), it's all really part of an umbrella.

Country isn't going to take pole position any time soon.

Edited October 12th by Arch
Arch
 

Do you remember when indie (or a close approximation to indie) was actually in the charts?

That just seems really fucking weird now.

Posted October 12th by Smiling Apple
Smiling Apple

The music industry, insofar as what is most popular and mass marketed, is currently saturated with hip hop and its derivatives. Just take a look at the US Billboard 100, or the Spotify Top 50, or any other domestic developed market around the world. This has been the case (i.e. as null says, eclipsing rock-pop and other loose popular genres) for the past 10-15 years at the very least and shows no signs of abating.

Rihanna might not be a rapper in the technical sense, but given contemporary RnB's close relationship with hip hop and how they all move with various trends in a similar fashion and at the same time (for example, the pseudo-dancehall formats that have been popular for the past 2 years in production), it's all really part of an umbrella.

Country isn't going to take pole position any time soon.


This is what i tell people. The day the electric guitar returns to the radio, in any form
, I will be happy. At this point, i'll settle for a proper remake of the duke of earl, that doesn't sound anything like modern remakes. Even scat would be ok at this point. Either way, things are as they are for reasons. I may not understand those reasons, but it is what it is. And just like everything wonderful that came to an end, so will this. I just hope i don't regret, some day, saying that. I fear for what will come next.

EDIT: What if Yello makes a comeback. I'm sorry, guys, i'll never wish for such things again.

Edited October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Webster, oxford, take your pick.


Webster:

a :to produce musical tones by means of the voice

b :to utter words in musical tones and with musical inflections and modulations

c :to deliver songs as a trained or professional singer


No mention of pitch ranges.

Oxford:

Make musical sounds with the voice, especially words with a set tune.


No mention of pitch ranges.

How is it not appropriate. You asked me how one differentiates the quality mentioned (pitch ranges). This is practically accomplished by using one's ears. It's just like identifying the colors red and green: one simply uses their eyes.


Not only is that not what I asked you (I asked you to show me the difference, not tell me the sense by which you came to the conclusion - why would I care?), that reasoning is nonequivalent. Red and green can be reduced to wavelength measurements. Artistry is far more subjective. Not only does music not require voice at all, there is nothing about "pitch ranges" that decides if something is musical.

The day the electric guitar returns to the radio, in any form, I will be happy.


Personally, I agree with you. But the metal scene is still incredibly expansive, even though it has been driven out of the mainstream.

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

No mention of pitch ranges.


A and B: Musical tones are the pitch ranges.

No mention of pitch ranges.


Tune is collection of pitches, with an implied importance to their organization.

Not only is that not what I asked you (I asked you to show me the difference, not tell me the sense by which you came to the conclusion - why would I care?), that reasoning is nonequivalent. Red and green can be reduced to wavelength measurements. Artistry is far more subjective. Not only does music not require voice at all, there is nothing about "pitch ranges" that decides if something is musical.


You sohuld have been clearer, then. But you're wrong, it's quite clear the definitions include pitch ranges.

Personally, I agree with you. But the metal scene is still incredibly expansive, even though it has been driven out of the mainstream.


Metal, Rock, etc. I don't see how it's out of "mainstream," unless it must be new and modern to be mainstream. "Classic rock" stations seem to be quite frequently used, for example. Turning on your TV or Radio is not your only source of music, but they are dedicated to their hand picked propagandists.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

A and B: Musical tones are the pitch ranges.


Tune is collection of pitches, with an implied importance to their organization.


You said "pitch ranges that exceed those of normal speech ranges", which is arbitrary and not supported by the definitions that you cited.

But you're wrong, it's quite clear the definitions include pitch ranges.


No, you're wrong. Your personal dogma concerning something as ephemeral as the musical value of various genres is not supported by any hard definition or inherent value.

If we were talking about something like harsh noise, you might have a case...emphasis on "might". But this is an absurd house of cards that you're trying to build here.

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

You said "pitch ranges that exceed those of normal speech ranges", which is arbitrary and not supported by the definitions that you cited.


if you don't believe in implicit definitions.

No, you're wrong. Your personal dogma concerning something as ephemeral as the musical value of various genres is not supported by any hard definition or inherent value.

If we were talking about something like harsh noise, you might have a case...emphasis on "might". But this is an absurd house of cards that you're trying to build here.


Rap is known for monotony of voice, which is in direct conflict with the subsequent definitions of the terms used in those definitions.

Without showing the progression (short on time, but if you'd like i'll show it later), at some point down the chain you should come across "chord" which points to having a series of varying pitches.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

It's OK to admit that you have a subjective opinion.

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

can a mod check his IP to make sure it's not red leaf?personal request

Posted October 12th by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

Kohlrak is not Red Leaf or any other GT user as far as I can tell.

Believe me, I checked days ago.

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

Thank you null keep up the good work

Posted October 12th by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

Why do I get the feeling that if somebody tr ied this when Obama was in office it would have been considered "racist" and otherwise unacceptable?

Posted October 12th by tnu
tnu

Didn't kid rock and a bunch of country singers try it?

Posted October 12th by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

There are so many wrong things being said in this thread from multiple people that I don't want to even bother. Don't even know why I bothered to check.

Posted October 12th by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

It's a good thing you bothered to post then.

Posted October 12th by Arch
Arch
 

i didn't realize that hip hop is just a collection of monotonous voices with no beat

Posted October 12th by poptart!
poptart!
 

as for eminem, he's talented, but he didn't really say anything particularly insightful or interesting here. it's basically just a collection of reddit comments, and i don't have time for that. besides, if everyone (whi matters), is already thinking something, is there any need to say it other than for masturbation?

Edited October 12th by poptart!
poptart!
 

It's a good thing you bothered to post then.


passive aggressive mod

Lol. I felt I should at least make my sentiments known since it's not even worth trying to reply to so many things when no one will care anyway since this forum is full of people who won't listen pretending they will.

Edited October 12th by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

Why do I get the feeling that if somebody tr ied this when Obama was in office it would have been considered "racist" and otherwise unacceptable?


Because they didn't have to be famous for someone to say that when anyone came out against him. And if you were against hillary in the primary against Obama you were sexist. Frankly, i'm surprised they didn't say that nearly as much during Trump vs Hillary.

Kohlrak is not Red Leaf or any other GT user as far as I can tell.

Believe me, I checked days ago.


Actually, I went to GT a long time ago. Ask Ragu, he'll remember me. Or .357. Or Furious D, or... The list goes on.

There are so many wrong things being said in this thread from multiple people that I don't want to even bother. Don't even know why I bothered to check.


I'm just humoring them, tbh. The idea of me having to prove that rap is not music is a logical fallacy (specifically, "null hypothesis"), so I could've ended this long ago.

as for eminem, he's talented, but he didn't really say anything particularly insightful or interesting here. it's basically just a collection of reddit comments, and i don't have time for that. besides, if everyone (whi matters), is already thinking something, is there any need to say it other than for masturbation?


People matter more than you give them credit. The left is particularly upset, because Trump wasn't even supposed to make it through the primary, let alone win the election. They're a little lost, confused, and their whole reality came crashing down, which is why there are so many videos of people crying. To quote, surely somebody, "it's unreal."

Lol. I felt I should at least make my sentiments known since it's not even worth trying to reply to so many things when no one will care anyway since this forum is full of people who won't listen pretending they will.


Which is why i'm not even taking the post seriously. I'm just trying to egg it on, since the hotter the topic gets, the more alive the place really is.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

"The left is particularly upset, because Trump wasn't even supposed to make it through the primary, let alone win the election. They're a little lost, confused, and their whole reality came crashing down, which is why there are so many videos of people crying. To quote, surely somebody, 'it's unreal.'"

EDIT: scratch that, i should know bettet than to post before i get my nicotine fix by now

anyway, that's not surprising, though; the left gives more of a shit. (meanwhile, the right walks around farting out of their mouths, saying garbage like "fuck u i've got mine"). imo

"I'm just trying to egg it on, since the hotter the topic gets, the more alive the place really is."

well that's rude

Edited October 12th by poptart!
poptart!
 

anyway, that's not surprising, though; the left gives more of a shit. (meanwhile, the right walks around farting out of their mouths, saying garbage like "fuck u i've got mine"). imo


Please read this: http://www.paulgraham.com/disagree.html

well that's rude


Maybe, but, honestly, which course of action is wiser in the long run?

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Lame. Em jumped the shark after the Recovery album. He needs drugs again.

I think it would have been cool if he had brought back Slim Shady as a Trump supporter and then had a sort of inner dialogue between his real self and Slim Shady, culminating in him “murdering” or exorcising Slim Shady from his being for good. Something more creative than “lol fuck Trump”. Pretty sure he is just riding the anti-Trump wave based on his creative laziness here.

Posted October 12th by pacman
pacman
 

"Please read this: http://www.paulgraham.com/disagree.html"

no thanks

i know that i used a strawman; i just don't care

Posted October 12th by poptart!
poptart!
 

I'm just humoring them, tbh. The idea of me having to prove that rap is not music is a logical fallacy (specifically, "null hypothesis"), so I could've ended this long ago.

Well you are a part of it, but whatever floats your boat I guess. Shitstorms can at least be amusing. Annoying, but amusing.

Posted October 12th by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

no thanks

i know that i used a strawman; i just don't care


You should read it, as you didn't make a strawman.

Well you are a part of it, but whatever floats your boat I guess. Shitstorms can at least be amusing. Annoying, but amusing.


Well, someone had to go and tell the emperor that he was running around naked, so looks like my parade was rained upon.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

"You should read it, as you didn't make a strawman."

my right wing caricature was literally a strawman, lol

Posted October 12th by poptart!
poptart!
 

Actually, I went to GT a long time ago. Ask Ragu, he'll remember me. Or .357. Or Furious D, or... The list goes on.


better safe than sorry. red leaf has this thing where he demands to be removed from the site only to come back on an alt account.

and didnt rago have a breakdown a few years back?

Posted October 12th by s.o.h.
s.o.h.
 

better safe than sorry. red leaf has this thing where he demands to be removed from the site only to come back on an alt account.


Who was he originally on gametalk?

and didnt rago have a breakdown a few years back?


Maybe. I haven't heard from any of those people in years. .357 was the GT contact i've heard most recently from, and that wasn't for at least 5 years ago. I lost contact with ragu long before this place was built.

my right wing caricature was literally a strawman, lol


Stawman argument is where you make your target up from scratch. You could argue that you made a strawman via metaphore, but then we'd be getting into the realm philosophy. Instead, you were applying attributes to an actual group of people. Ad hominem.

Posted October 12th by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 



Posted October 12th by poptart!
poptart!
 

Who was he originally on gametalk?


the oi

Posted October 12th by nullfather
nullfather
 

eminem looks like a transmen with that beard

Posted October 12th by Brandy
Brandy
 

the oi


Sounds vaguely familiar, like someone who did the same thing back in those days, too. Was he always on complaints throwing a fit?

EDIT: The more i think about it, the more i think he might've been spending alot of time on pointless, too. Could just be my mind playing tricks on me, though. I distinctly remember a couple people trying to be buddy, buddy with Denida all the time but then trying to get banned, and then i think one in particular then liked to complain about being banned after requesting it.

Edited Friday by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

If I remember correctly, his biggest concerns were whether heaven existed and, if it did, would he be able to have sex there.

Edited Friday by Malas
Malas
 

Only if you use a subjective definition. For objective definitions, it does not matter

Well objectively rap is music because of the background music. If singing is required for music, then instrumental/electronic music isn't music, which is nonsense.

Posted Friday by Xhin
Xhin
 

Do you remember when indie (or a close approximation to indie) was actually in the charts?

I guess that's what happens when rock goes to independent labels; no mainstream coverage of it whatsoever.

The day the electric guitar returns to the radio, in any form, I will be happy.

The radio is dead. The more the internet becomes easily accessible the more this will be true.

can a mod check his IP to make sure it's not red leaf?personal request

Kohlrak was actually around back in 2014 in the RP boards.

The idea of me having to prove that rap is not music is a logical fallacy (specifically, "null hypothesis"), so I could've ended this long ago.

Okay then, what is rap if it isn't "music"?

Posted Friday by Xhin
Xhin
 

If I remember correctly, his biggest concerns were whether heaven existed and, if it did, would he be able to have sex there.


At least the guy's honest. Most people would wonder those two things at some point in their lives. Unfortuntely, if he was obsessed, it was probably for a reason, and reason most likely was not prior success.

Well objectively rap is music because of the background music. If singing is required for music, then instrumental/electronic music isn't music, which is nonsense.


"What Would You Do if Jesus Came to Your House" by Porter Wagoner is a great example of this. I've hesitated quite a bit to call it music for this very reason, even before discussing rap. The forefront, is not music, just as you would not call a speech music simply because it had music in the background. A new phenomena seen alot today is to inject rap into songs, and when doing so, there are noticeable breaks in the song that are distinctly different from the singing portions.

The radio is dead. The more the internet becomes easily accessible the more this will be true.


I'll be fine with that.

Kohlrak was actually around back in 2014 in the RP boards.


2014? GT was still around then?

Okay then, what is rap if it isn't "music"?


The old definition before calling it "music" was "to speak quickly." Most originally, to rap is to strike ("As of some one gently rapping, rapping at my chamber door." ~Edgar Allan Poe: The Raven). From there it came to mean to harshly criticize someone (as if beating them with your words). From there, it managed to extend beyond just criticism, and just to mean to speak suddenly and/or sharply as if breaking silence. Then, more specifically in america, it came to mean to speak quickly, especially informally. Auctioneers were known for this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fYV3dJp-k4
You'll hear it used twice in the recording below, as well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrZlWw8Di10

Posted Friday by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

(Kohlrak is a legitimate user; he frequented the original GT around the same time I did, like 14 years ago or so. Hi Kohlrak, it's me, RubyLizard. We actually caught up a few times some years back. Welcome back! Hope you stay a little while.)

Posted Friday by Ophelia
Ophelia

If I remember correctly, his biggest concerns were whether heaven existed and, if it did, would he be able to have sex there.

No that was Cupola.

Edited Friday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

Always mix them up.

Posted Friday by Malas
Malas
 

Welcome back! Hope you stay a little while.)


We'll see. Later on tonight, i'll go missing for a few days. That much is for certain.

Posted Friday by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

I guess that's what happens when rock goes to independent labels; no mainstream coverage of it whatsoever.

You may have misunderstood me. There actually was a period in Britain when indie bands topped the charts. Basically throughout the early-mid noughties. Groups like the Libertines, the Kaiser Chiefs, Kasabian, The Wombats; and post-punk revival bands like Maximo Park, etc.

This may have not crossed over into America.

Posted Friday by Smiling Apple
Smiling Apple

We had that in the early 2000s... But it wasn't rock... And it doesn't need to be remembered...

Posted Friday by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

This may have not crossed over into America.

It sort of did, I think. As far as super popular indie/quasi-indie goes, around that time period we had things like Spoon, Wilco, Fugazi, maybe Built to Spill, and a little later -- I guess still now -- things like Modest Mouse, The White Stripes, The Strokes, Arcade Fire, so on. And earlier, I guess things like The Smiths, Sonic Youth, etc.

We'll see. Later on tonight, i'll go missing for a few days. That much is for certain.

How come? Are you alright? I know it's not the friendliest here, but sometimes the conversation is interesting.

Posted Friday by Ophelia
Ophelia

We had that in the early 2000s... But it wasn't rock... And it doesn't need to be remembered...

Early 2000s was, for the most part, a hilarious time for music in America.

Posted Friday by Ophelia
Ophelia

It sort of did, I think. As far as super popular indie/quasi-indie goes, around that time period we had things like Spoon, Wilco, Fugazi, maybe Built to Spill, and a little later -- I guess still now -- things like Modest Mouse, The White Stripes, The Strokes, Arcade Fire, so on. And earlier, I guess things like The Smiths, Sonic Youth, etc.

But those bands were never in the charts. Some may have flirted with success - The White Stripes, The Strokes, and Arcade Fire certainly did - but bands like Wilco, Fugazi, Built to Spill and Modest Mouse were only ever "alternative" bands (as much as I love those bands).

The Smiths were big, but then they were an 80s band, and alternative rock was a big thing in the 80s/90s.

Sonic Youth never had much success, as far as I'm aware?

We had that in the early 2000s... But it wasn't rock... And it doesn't need to be remembered...

"Rock" - if by that you mean stale guitar-wankery, died in the 70s where it belongs.

Posted Friday by Smiling Apple
Smiling Apple

P.S. Ophelia, what's your fav Fugazi/Modest Mouse/Built to Spill/Smiths/Sonic Youth album?

Posted Friday by Smiling Apple
Smiling Apple

How come? Are you alright?


Absolutely. I'm not going to get into that kind of trouble. If anything gets to me, it'll come without warning.

I know it's not the friendliest here, but sometimes the conversation is interesting.


Have you ever known me to care about that? XD

Early 2000s was, for the most part, a hilarious time for music in America.


I don't know if it's because i woke up after 2 hours of sleep or not, but this one makes me giggle. It was more than just hilarious. Hopefully we look back at today with the same amusement, between swift, cyrus, and the rest on gilligan's island.

"Rock" - if by that you mean stale guitar-wankery, died in the 70s where it belongs.


I'll have you know, i still take it. In fact, i'll take doo wop at this point.

Edited Friday by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

I think we forget that chart music has always been shit. Some people think it was The Beatles, then Pink Floyd, then The Smiths, then Nirvana, then Radiohead. But it wasn't. Everyone forgets that it has always been a sea of utter shite making up 99% of the charts from the 60s right up until today. Those bands were not the norm.

Posted Friday by Smiling Apple
Smiling Apple

Pareto distribution

Posted Friday by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Trump more like Drumpf
ha nah more like Blumpf
that dude looks like a Flumpf
yo, yo just call him Mr Stumpf
i take it back i call em Gumpf
haha oh shit looks its Mr Zumpf
Woke up look like Pumpf
With a big bag of
So go and tell President Vumpf
we dont need another Lumpf

Trump will not be able to recover from this.

Posted Friday by #85
#85

Nobody was talking about him being a falling star until after he said the truth... I'm sorry, shamed Trump. But it's kind of hard not to do that while saying the truth.

Eminem is a rap God. He proved it then, and he can still prove it now.

Posted Friday by mariomguy
mariomguy
What up, 1-up

Nobody was talking about him being a falling star until after he said the truth... I'm sorry, shamed Trump. But it's kind of hard not to do that while saying the truth.

Eminem is a rap God. He proved it then, and he can still prove it now.


I questioned his relevance, because the gravity of his statements weighs upon it (else we'd hear from other less famous people, too). So, by pointing out his irrelevance, I don't have to bother addressing any of his claims. Does he have any? idk, first i need a damn translator.

Posted Friday by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

Eminem is a rap God.

I don't care how popular he is, reading that made me figuratively roll my eyes. No offense to you, just that statement.

Edited Friday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

Just a stunt for his new album.

Posted Friday by #85
#85

"P.S. Ophelia, what's your fav Fugazi/Modest Mouse/Built to Spill/Smiths/Sonic Youth album?"

i'm not ophelia but i'd like to answer this too:

Fugazi:
In on the Kill Taker

Sonic Youth:
Confusion Is Sex

lol just kidding, it's probably Goo but only because i've listened to Daydream Nation too many times

The Smiths:
Strangeways, Here We Come
(because i love "Girlfriend in a Coma" so much)


not a fan of modest mouse or built to spill

Edited Friday by poptart!
poptart!
 

I don't care how popular he is, reading that made me figuratively roll my eyes. No offense to you, just that statement.



Posted Friday by mariomguy
mariomguy
What up, 1-up

Yes I'm aware of where it comes from.

Posted Friday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

Calling anyone a "god" because they're really good at what they do is always a statement more dramatic than literal. But Eminem is one of the few people that I would call dominant enough at their field to justify the drama.

This isn't "he sold the most records so he's the best". I say this because I've sat down and looked at his rhyme structures, composition, wordplay, etc. Not that I have the most experience with rap, but unless you're going to go with someone with a lot less appeal like Aesop Rock, Eminem is the dude.

Posted Saturday by nullfather
nullfather
 

It just looks really stupid especially when the G is capitalized and I think people have shit tastes to put him so high. Rap by itself isn't really my thing but even then I know of several examples of better rappers. That's the way I see it though, you're entitled to think he's worth it but I don't have to.

Posted Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

"Rock" - if by that you mean stale guitar-wankery, died in the 70s where it belongs.

I guess I just learned another way to refer to my favorite genre of music. I also didn't know that no songs in that genre had been written in 50 years. What do you listen to SA?

Posted Saturday by Jahoy Hoy
Jahoy Hoy

One of the things about being in a Metro Detroit public school in 2001 is that Marshall Mathers certainly did seem like the God of a great many people. You'd have been hard pressed to find a greater concentration of children with bleach blond buzz cuts, though unlike the star they were emulating they couldn't quite afford the weekly maintenance that style required.

Mathers does not nearly command that sort of following now and he probably never will again. The depths of celebrity desperation can admittedly go much deeper than this, but it is nevertheless an obvious publicity stunt and I struggle to see how he stands to benefit from this gamble. In a couple of days the discussion will be over and if anyone will have taken this message to heart it will be those Trump supporters in his audience who will decide, much like they did with the godawful haircuts they were getting nearly two decades earlier, that EMINƎM is no longer relevant to their lives.

Posted Saturday by Famov
Famov

Freestyle lyrics are really unimpressive when you read them in text form tbh.

Posted Saturday by Dice
Dice
 

Rap by itself isn't really my thing but even then I know of several examples of better rappers.


Like who? And, like I said, I'm not denying that there are better rappers, but he's the best with the most appeal. Being a cultural force like the term "god" implies requires mass appeal.

much like they did with the godawful haircuts they were getting nearly two decades earlier


You got a problem with buzz cuts? Or just bleached buzz cuts?

Edited Saturday by nullfather
nullfather
 

Famov really dislikes famous people huh

Posted Saturday by A.o.h.
A.o.h.
 

You got a problem with buzz cuts? Of just bleached buzz cuts?

Bleached. I've been buzzing my hair since I was 13.

Famov really dislikes famous people huh



This is my favorite joke.

Posted Saturday by Famov
Famov

Bleached. I've been buzzing my hair since I was 13.


Fair enough. I really don't get hair coloring. It seems overly indulgent and superficial.

Posted Saturday by nullfather
nullfather
 

Why do you dislike them though. Eminem wasn't born into wealth. And I'd argue he had a bigger following later on in his career as his music became a lot more accessible to the masses.

Posted Saturday by A.o.h.
A.o.h.
 

Like who?

Death Grips :^) but really almost every other rapper I've heard. I don't even remember most of their names so that probably says something about him.

Being a cultural force like the term "god" implies requires mass appeal.

Still dumb.

Edited Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

I think you are just trying to hate on somebody whose popular and cool for the sake of hating on them lol

Posted Saturday by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

I think you are just trying to hate on somebody whose popular and cool for the sake of hating on them lol


People can't genuinely dislike or criticize something popular without the only reason being that they're hipsters

Man I wish I could be this narrow-minded sometimes.

But I have one for you too. I think you're just assblasted because I don't like what you like and because I (obviously) don't think he deserves to be that immensely popular due to the fact that I simply don't think he's that great. The fact that BETTER ones don't get recognized because people like him are paid attention to instead is also a factor. This happens with many things. Games, shows, movies, and so on. It's not that things are inherently bad because they're popular but it sure does happen.

Of course, I don't expect much to happen simply by pointing this out, but I can say that we live in an age where countless music is available on the internet and so many good things go unnoticed. Rap just isn't where my focus is. I'm actually not even much for music in and of itself really but even I know this. I can understand that a lot of people are afraid to step outside of their comfort zones, or they simply don't have the time to go exploring for better music but I hate this sentiment that "because it's popular it has to be good" or "because it's not popular it has to prove itself extra hard".

Perhaps most importantly though, he just doesn't appeal to me in particular. Plus all I said is that it's dumb to call anyone a "god" for no real reason.

Edited Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

BUT if you want some examples aside from Death Grips I suppose I could dig up some popular rappers in my mind (or formerly popular since like I said I don't bother with rap much) off of the top of my head. Kayne, T.I., Lil Jon Tyler the Creator.

And I don't really like any of them very much at all. They had like 1 to several songs that I would consider decent but I would still say they're better than him.

Edited Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

TI better than Eminem I really can't take that seriously . I would say Kanye is on par with Em though

Posted Saturday by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

Kayne, T.I., Lil Jon Tyler the Creator.


The only one of those even vaguely close to Em is Kanye and Kanye still isn't his match either technically or sales-wise.

Lil Jon isn't even really a rapper. He's a producer. lol

And I don't really like any of them very much at all. They had like 1 to several songs that I would consider decent but I would still say they're better than him.


You literally just don't like it. Which you admitted, but then you tried to build arguments on you not liking it. Like this:

Plus all I said is that it's dumb to call anyone a "god" for no real reason.


The reasons are very real. Just because you do not care or prefer other "rappers" doesn't make them fake or nonexistent.

Posted Saturday by nullfather
nullfather
 

TI better than Eminem I really can't take that seriously . I would say Kanye is on par with Em though.

Whatever, like I said rap doesn't even matter to me.

Lil Jon isn't even really a rapper. He's a producer. lol

And the fact that I didn't know that shows how little I care, and little I think of Eminem's work.

You literally just don't like it. Which you admitted

I never admitted that and it isn't the case. I said it's my OPINION, just like literally everything here is an OPINION. I said I don't like it but I also think there are very good reasons for not liking it which is also just an OPINION. But if we're just going to keep reading opinions as elitism and simply reducing it to "you just don't like this thing!" then there can be no real discussion. Also please get over your trolling habits. You're a fucking admin now, act like one.

Also why can't I not like something while also having actual reasons for it? Inb4 "but you don't". Ugh I already gave some of my reasons in that textwall.

The reasons are very real. Just because you do not care or prefer other "rappers" doesn't make them fake or nonexistent.

In your opinion. They are not a god literally or even close to figuratively. Stop acting like I'm the elitist while being an elitist yourself. You're also assuming my only reasoning for it sounding stupid has anything to do with that in the first place.

Edited Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

the only rapper who I would consider better than em would be Nas. But their styles are largely different that's for surw

Posted Saturday by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

the only rapper who I would consider better than em would be Nas.

Hell yeah, Nas is GOAT.


Posted Saturday by pacman
pacman
 

i love nas. 'if i ruled the world' is literally one of my favorite songs

Posted Saturday by Brandy
Brandy
 

Why does it seem like some people only bother with me when I'm talking about petty things or they're acting like they want to be involved in a potential "shitstorm"? Why not when I'm actually trying to have an actual discussion that matters and not getting caught up in things like a pissing contest about things like who likes or dislikes what better and who is justified for that just because I was also expressing my opinions?

And then why is it that there are people who act like I'm absolutely nothing but a shitposter or something like that? I mean there's a very recent example of me NOT being like that in the benevolent dictatorship thread. Hell I at least tried to start a discussion pointing out the immense amount of music that goes unnoticed but can still be great if not better. No one cared about that part of what I said though. Part of why I try less now days.

Edited Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

Listen to Kendrick Lamar and tell me he doesn't rap with different pitches and cadences. Rap is more than talking. It's also melodic spoken poetry with a variety of flows that can be utilized.

If you haven't heard Kendrick, your critical opinion of hip-hop does not hold weight.

Posted Saturday by Blazer72
Blazer72
 

He said TI was better than Eminem dog. His opinion never had any weight lol

Posted Saturday by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

If you haven't heard Kendrick, your critical opinion of hip-hop does not hold weight.

??? I just said I don't like rap typically with the exception of things like Death Grips if you count that, the only thing I've been critical of is Eminem. If you meant to say I'm not qualified to criticize him to that, I don't need to be well-versed in the genre to think he's not very good at it personally.

Ugh.

He said TI was better than Eminem dog. His opinion never had any weight lol

You're placing WAYYYY too much importance on that. I don't even like him. Had like one good song.

Edited Sunday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

You aren't any better than me, and you don't know better than me by default so you can stop pretending you do now.

Edited Sunday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

Keep it cool.

Posted Saturday by nullfather
nullfather
 

WAYYYY too much importance on that.

But its true though. I am not going to take your opinion seriously if you think some one like TI is a better rapper than Eminem. Or if you think a producer is a better rapper.

I get it you dont like eminem. You dont have to. But he has been called the King of Rap for a reason. Only a handful of rappers can come close to touching his popularity and the majority of them fall short of being better than him.



I am happy there are so many Nas fans on these boards :D

Posted Saturday by s.o.h.
s.o.h.
 

Keep it cool.

?

Edited Sunday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

I am not going to take your opinion seriously if you think some one like TI is a better rapper than Eminem. Or if you think a producer is a better rapper.

You can do that, but it doesn't completely invalidate me like you were literally saying. From my point of view if I think he's worse than them in the first place, that is only a sign of how much I don't think he's that great. If the purpose of music is to be enjoyable, and it isn't then I don't see why it's not okay to say I don't think something should be as popular as it is. Thus, REGARDLESS of how much experience I have with the genre, there is no reason to invalidate me simply because I think one thing is better than the other. If Eminem really is that good, why did he not impress me? What would change if I did listen to even more rap?

But he has been called the King of Rap for a reason.

King is less stupid of a title at least.

Only a handful of rappers can come close to touching his popularity and the majority of them fall short of being better than him.

I refuse to judge worth or greatness by popularity alone

Posted Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

to be fair. you seem to hate everything from what I gathered with interacting with you on these forums. So I wouldnt be surprised if eminem didnt impress you. Shit I wouldnt be surprised if the Northern lights or the second coming of christ didnt impress you.

Cant do much about that buddy.

Posted Saturday by S.O.H.
S.O.H.
 

to be fair. you seem to hate everything from what I gathered with interacting with you on these forums

I'll admit you legitimately got a chuckle out of me but I hope you don't mean this literally, it's nowhere close to the truth. Not sure why you would think I hate everything when I even said something I like in this thread. Hell it was even about a genre I don't particularly care for: Death Grips.

But one thing I do hate is... how things like this just keep happening. I say what I like and what I approve of and who at times but, that is ignored by people like you apparently.

I think the problem is aside from you ignoring it when it's there I don't like to talk about my interests too much unless they're brought up, and it turns out I don't have much in common with this place, but I had plenty nice to say in the fire emblem heroes and echoes threads. I also recently gave Fallout 4 praise and said I didn't understand the backlash against it.

Edited Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

Not sure why you would think I hate everything

thats what I gathered from interacting with you over the years. Am I wrong probably. Am I right probably.


I don't like to talk about my interests

You should from now on IMO.

Posted Saturday by S.O.H.
S.O.H.
 

You should from now on IMO.

Well like I said, if they're brought up and I feel like it I might. It seems rather pointless to though considering the times I have tried and then usually absolutely no one gave a shit anyway.

Edited Saturday by KnokkelMillennium
KnokkelMillennium
The machiavellian menace

I'm not a fan of Em.

Posted Sunday by Blazer72
Blazer72
 

Fugazi: In on the Kill Taker

Good choice. I like how angry and raw it is.

It would either be Red Medicine or The Argument for me though.

The Smiths: Strangeways, Here We Come

YES! Correct answer.

Too many novelty songs on The Queen is Dead for me.

not a fan of modest mouse or built to spill

Built to Spill I can take or leave to be honest. I only got into them through Modest Mouse.

But early Modest Mouse is brilliant. Lonesome Crowded West is one of my favourite albums ever.

the only rapper who I would consider better than em would be Nas.

Eminem is better than Q-Tip?
Eminem is better than Rakim?
Eminem is better than any of the Beastie Boys?

Can't argue with Nas though. One of the greatest.

Edited Sunday by Smiling Apple
Smiling Apple

To Pimp A Butterfly and DAMN are better than anything Em's ever written.

Posted Sunday by Blazer72
Blazer72
 

shit how did this thread explode? lol

Posted Sunday by ShadowFox08
ShadowFox08

To Pimp A Butterfly and DAMN are better than anything Em's ever written.


I'm more of a fan of Kendrick than I am of Eminem, but I think Eminem is a better technical rapper.

Well, maybe saying I'm a bigger fan of Kendrick is more complicated than it seems. Because Em has higher highs for me (I really like his Slim Shady stuff), but Kendrick is more consistent. Complicated, but still true. I can name more Kendrick tracks that I like off the top of my head than Em tracks. Here's a couple.







shit how did this thread explode? lol


Kohlrak.

Edited Sunday by nullfather
nullfather
 

"The Blacker The Berry" had me hyped when it dropped.

Some Kendrick tracks:

The Art of Peer Pressure
Good Kid
Swimming Pools
Black Boy Fly
Mortal Man
The Blacker The Berry
Ronald Reagan Era
These Walls
Hood Politics
Complexion
Momma
How Much A Dollar Cost

I have respect for Em's bars. But I feel a stronger connection to Kendrick's music. It's empowering, to me at least.

Posted Sunday by Blazer72
Blazer72
 

I dont like Kendrick. More of a J cole man my self these days.

Posted Sunday by s.o.h.
s.o.h.
 

@Smiling Apple

But those bands were never in the charts. Some may have flirted with success - The White Stripes, The Strokes, and Arcade Fire certainly did - but bands like Wilco, Fugazi, Built to Spill and Modest Mouse were only ever "alternative" bands (as much as I love those bands).

Hmm, I think Modest Mouse was in the charts for a while ("Float On," which happens to be one of my least favorite Modest Mouse songs). But you're right, I was thinking more along the lines of what was on everybody's T-shirts, and even the more popular indie bands probably just had 1 or 2 big hits (often singles).

I think we forget that chart music has always been shit. Some people think it was The Beatles, then Pink Floyd, then The Smiths, then Nirvana, then Radiohead. But it wasn't. Everyone forgets that it has always been a sea of utter shite making up 99% of the charts from the 60s right up until today. Those bands were not the norm.

No, I totally agree. It's probably more like 99.9% shite, though, haha.

Smiths: Also Strangeways, Here We Come (also "Girlfriend in a Coma")
Fugazi: Also The Argument
Built to Spill: I've only heard like one or two Built to Spill songs, and I can't remember what they're called. I don't remember disliking it, butI don't remember liking it much, either. They just came to mind when I listed Modest Mouse.
Sonic Youth: Sister
Modest Mouse: Sad, Sappy Sucker got me through high school, but The Lonesome Crowded West & The Moon & Antarctica are probably my favorites

----

I don't like Eminem; think his cadence is... lame (I can't think of a better word at the moment). Most of his songs sound really similar to me, except maybe the older, kind of goofy stuff. I don't like the style, either, the yelling, and I think the rhymes are too straightforward. It's like

instead of FIGHTin
we should be UNITin
cause all this BULLshut be keepin me up and NIGHTin
aw, shit i don't even know what's RIGHT and

I don't know. Kind of seems forced, maybe even lazy.

Posted Yesterday Afternoon by Ophelia
Ophelia

Damn this thread is so far gone since my last reply i can't invest in following it anymore.

I don't know. Kind of seems forced, maybe even lazy.


Something i noticed with mainstream anymore, anymore: no talent (autotune), no originality (remakes), just a pretty face (well, some of of them used to be, now alot of them don't even have that).

Posted Yesterday Afternoon by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 

I generally like Eminem, but definitely wouldn't be at the top of my "best" or "favorite" rappers. (You can put me in the Nas or Kendrick Lamar, there. Honestly? In the "favorite" category, I'll take Method Man and Redman over Eminem as well.)

I kinda disagree with the notion that the bulk of chart music has been shit. I think it really depends on the year. There have been plenty of good years with music that hits the charts. It's just hard to really make a sweeping claim about it when we're talking about hundreds of songs over tens of years. That's a lot of music! But yeah, it is a tiny sample of everything that's out there. Generally can't rely on it as an indication of anything.


As for the original subject, all I really have to say is... I would love to try and explain to people 10 years ago that in 2017, people would be looking to Eminem, Kid Rock, and the Insane Clown Posse as political figureheads. Don't even think Mike Judge would have figured that one out.

Posted Last Night by Jet Presto
Jet Presto

And how about Donald Trump being president?

Posted Last Night by Kohlrak
Kohlrak
 
Reply to: Eminem blasts Trump in a free style rap at BET Awards and gives fans an ultimatum

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