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I'll be sure to let you all know what I think of it afterwards

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There are 18 Replies

It was definitely different and did not go the way I thought.



Posted December 24th, 2017 by -Riku-
-Riku-
 
Redack
Altname for Moonray

There's another thread, but I'll just say this:



Posted December 25th, 2017 by Jet Presto
Jet Presto



Posted December 29th, 2017 by -Riku-
-Riku-
 

Kylo a possibly interesting character has been thrown out the airlock.

how?

Snoke was supposed to be this threat so powerful that not even Luke could take him on

I havent watched TFA in over a year. But I dont think this was ever the case. Luke gave up being a jedi and wanted to be left alone.

If he was afraid of anyone it was kylo not snoke.

I have no idea how the force works. as its ever changing and what not. I would imagine there is a way to track down other force users.



Edited December 29th, 2017 by s.o.h.
s.o.h.
 

Snoke was supposed to be this threat so powerful that not even Luke could take him on

The films more likely imply that Snoke fears Luke, but currently he would be able to face Luke 2 on 1. If Luke was no kind of threat, Snoke and Kylo wouldn't want to hunt him down.

Thanks to that, everything that made Kylo a possibly interesting character has been thrown out the airlock.

Personally I think it makes him more interesting and more likely he won't be a carbon copy of Vader. I'm just worried it means no backstory on Snoke like I wanted. I really found Kylo the most interesting character in TLJ, and also the one that made the most sense.

Posted December 29th, 2017 by Trever Leingod
Trever Leingod

Kylo was struggling between the light and dark, but now he no longer has that struggle. Also, all the generals of the order feared Snoke which, in my mind, put him on the same pedestal as Sidious. Also

Posted December 29th, 2017 by -Riku-
-Riku-
 

Four Leia is still alive.



Edited December 29th, 2017 by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

Yeah I would not put snoke on the power level of either sidious or Vader.

Posted December 29th, 2017 by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

Leia will be dead come next movie. And Snoke was the leader of the First Order. Also, Snoke managed to force slam General Hux from another place in the galaxy. I'd say that puts him on at LEAST Vader's level

Posted December 29th, 2017 by -Riku-
-Riku-
 

as of right now she's still alive so I'm counting her.

And no he hasn't done enough to put him at that level lol

Edited December 29th, 2017 by S.o.h.
S.o.h.
 

Kylo was struggling between the light and dark, but now he no longer has that struggle.

He "appeared" to stop struggling. This is not confirmed. Either way, that by no means makes him any less interesting, that's merely progression.

Also how many Force users remain in the galaxy is relevant how? Also, the Knights of Ren could also be Force users (we know too little about them at this point).

Yeah I would not put snoke on the power level of either sidious or Vader.

He has to be relative to them, for Kylo to fear or respect him.

Posted December 29th, 2017 by Trever Leingod
Trever Leingod

And no he hasn't done enough to put him at that level lol

By feats in the movies? Objectively, he's done more impressive Force feats than Vader or Sidious.

Posted December 29th, 2017 by Trever Leingod
Trever Leingod

FWIW I think mentioning that a certain character is still alive after the movie counts as spoilers.

I have no idea if we are supposed to think that Snoke > Palpatine. He has more of an opportunity to demonstrate his powers than Palpatine, at least Palpatine in the OT (but the general overpowered nature of the Force in this movie may have something to do with that). But I do think that Kylo Ren is by far the most interesting part of these new movies.

Posted December 29th, 2017 by white lancer
white lancer
 

By no means am I the first or only one to note this about Kylo Ren, but here's what I love about him as a villain (no spoilers really, although I may mention a passing moment that is scene from the trailers):

I think what I love about Kylo Ren is his entire thing is a place of insecurity. The pressure of being progeny of the most heralded heroes and leaders of the Alliance, with a Force bloodline that is almost royalty, one can only imagine the shadow he was living in as a child. And as he moved to the Dark Side, he found himself failing to live up to the Vader reputation as well. He appears neither able to be the kind of hero Luke or Leia was, nor the kind of villain that his grandfather Anakin was, but he evidently feels pressure to be one of those things. I think this is a wise move, and kinda meta when you consider the pressure they must have felt trying to come up with a villain that could even possibly rival Vader. They wisely seem to recognize that they can't, so they make the villain centered on an insecure child, basically, who *wants* to be Vader, but fails.

And for all the talk he does of letting the past die, he himself struggles to do it. There's too much immaturity and insecurity there. I feel like the entire finale of The Last Jedi is centered on his actions, which appear driven by that lack of confidence. He goes overboard to try and destroy, effectively, his past. Symbols of it, at least. This makes him a profoundly more interesting character, especially by the end of TLJ, where I don't know about anyone else, but, I'm definitely not sure at all if he can be redeemed. It appeared like that was where the story was going, but it also appears, after two films, that the more insecure he's become, the more unstable he's become, and the more he tries to fight his past, the further he slips into the Dark Side. I don't know that he is redeemable at this point.

To me, it's a way better villain than even Vader. Less iconic, sure, but more interesting.

Posted December 29th, 2017 by Jet Presto
Jet Presto

imo darth nihilus is more powerful than vader and sidious

Edited December 29th, 2017 by Brandy
Brandy

imo darth nihilus is more powerful than vader and sidious


I would say that he is, but Nihilus isn't canon any longer. As this is a discussion about the cinematic universe, Nihilus isn't very relevant.

Posted December 29th, 2017 by nullfather
nullfather

He was actually considered average as a duelist and with Force power. It was his power with Force Drain that made him so dangerous. The one time he came across someone immune to it, he was left to his other skills, which weren't so great. But take away Force Drain, and he is very beatable.

Sidious, on the other hand, took on some of the most skilled and powerful Jedi ever. He was also stated to be the most powerful Sith ever, likely due to the fact he surrendered himself completely to the Dark Side, have no attachments and likely a sociopath (which allowed him to easily surrender himself to the Dark Side).

Posted January 3rd by Trever Leingod
Trever Leingod
Reply to: Going to see The Last Jedi today

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