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A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms




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meeeeh why doesn't your sister like meeee

maybe because all you two do is make snippy, passive-aggressive jabs at each other

thanks be to the old gods and the new that they finally had an actual goddamn conversation

Posted April 23rd by Pirate_Ninja

I have yet to watch a single episode of GoT. I'm always late to the party, I was late to Watching Dexter and How I met you rmother. I'll get around to GoT at some point as my wife as been wanting to get HBO fir a while.

Posted April 23rd by Q
Q
 

HBO is actually a pretty solid deal. You can get HBO Now for $15/month and cancel any time. I plan to cancel once Game of Thrones ends, but they have a lot of good content.

I would recommend trying to read the books first. I wish I had. It's not a terrible thing, but since I had seen the show actors first, that is who I always picture in my mind while reading the books. Of course, you probably wouldn't be able to get to the end solely through the books anyway unless you started to read them in like 20 years.

Posted April 23rd by Vandy

My thoughts:



However, it wasn't without its problems:




Posted April 23rd by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful

Loved this episode. I won't go so far as to say it was the best since Season 4 ("Hardhome" and "Winds of Winter" are in my personal Top 3 alongside "Rains of Castamere"), but I don't think it's a stretch at all to say it's better than anything in Season 7. While the premiere was just fine, this one really made me optimistic about the rest of the season.



Posted April 23rd by white lancer

@Xhin:



Posted April 23rd by white lancer

Actually I just realized:



Posted April 23rd by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful



Edited April 24th by white lancer



Posted April 24th by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful

Also thought this was a great episode. I've missed these kinds of character moments as the show went on from the first few seasons.

Random thoughts:



Re: Crypt



Something Else



Posted April 24th by Count Dooku

Sometimes I wish I gave a shit about GoT so I could be in on it and take part in the cultural discussion, but I just can't. I saw the first episode maybe 6 years ago and was indifferent. Watch real kino like Twin Peaks!

Posted April 25th by MarvaIo
MarvaIo
 

Man, Twin Peaks was fucking good. At least up until they found the murderer and then the story started to drag.

Posted April 25th by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful

Sometimes I wish I gave a shit about GoT so I could be in on it and take part in the cultural discussion, but I just can't. I saw the first episode maybe 6 years ago and was indifferent


I mean, the TV show is popularist HBO faff. Read the books so you can take part in the cultural discussion about...the fucking horrible spaghetti mess that is the novel plot? Christ. Or just don't bother unless you're a fantasy geek like me. Read kino fantasy like Malazan or what have you.

Posted April 25th by Cruinn-Annuin

Crypts:



Other:



Surprised to see a Malazan reference here in any context. I've been working my way through those novels and really like them.

Anyone got any death predictions for the next episode? I see a few characters as safe, and I figure that we're otherwise going to have one or two "major" deaths alongside quite a few "minor" deaths.

Safe (?) characters:



Major death candidates:



Cannon fodder:



Posted April 25th by white lancer

white lancer:



Edited April 25th by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful

Anyone got any death predictions for the next episode?


Safe:



Who could die:



Posted April 25th by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful

There's not a great reason for this (unless you subscribe to the theory about Sam writing the books at the end)


The red book of westeros

Posted April 25th by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful

I don't think the show is wrapping up the White Walker plotline this episode, but I can't rule it out.


There was a vision of the iron throne being covered in snow that hasn't happened yet, so my bet is on Winter coming south before it's all over

Posted April 25th by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful

@Xhin



RE: Night King



Posted April 25th by Moonray
Moonray
 

@Moonray: something that isn't NIFE:



Posted April 25th by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful

The battle of Mereen was like 4 minutes long and mostly just consisted of the dragons burning the ships and not much else. It definitely was not an epic battle and I don't really recall it playing out alongside the BotB. It might have shared an episode with it but it wasn't really simultaneous.

Edited April 25th by Moonray
Moonray
 

@Moonray



Edited April 25th by Vandy



Posted April 26th by Moonray
Moonray
 



Edited April 26th by I killed Mufasa
I killed Mufasa
long live the king

Apparently I don't know how to do that.

Posted April 26th by I killed Mufasa
I killed Mufasa
long live the king

[hide] Text Here [/hide]

Posted April 26th by Moonray
Moonray
 

Fixed your spoiler tags, Mufasa.


So, this is the first episode I have seen since, like, the first or second episode of season five. Feel kinda fine about it. Wasn't too hard to figure out what was going on. (Plus, my friend was willing to fill me in. Apparently, his name is Theon, not Thyroid. Whoops.)

I liked it, and highlighted many of the things I liked about Game of Thrones when I watched it, while avoiding many of the things I didn't like. Granted, the next episode appears to be nothing but battle, which - while I appreciate on a technical level - I find fundamentally boring. It's not that the action isn't well done, and obviously they're going to kill off some beloved characters to "hit the audience in the feels"



But...these episode-long battle episodes don't often advance plot or character arcs. They're sort of just there for the eye candy and then to kill off characters



And I dunno. I watched that big battle one in, what, season 5? And it was impressive technically, but I found it boring.

I also think - having come back in just as the White Walkers are really front and center for the conflict - but the White Walkers are boooooring. I'm curious if there is any lore reasons to care about them, besides being just hyper-simplified monster villains. Anyone have any info on that?

Posted April 26th by Jet Presto



Edited April 26th by I killed Mufasa
I killed Mufasa
long live the king

In the show the white walkers are just boring. We had an origin story that lasted all of 5 seconds to tell but that's generally the extent of their lore.

They did have an interesting mystery going with them having a deal with that guy whose lives beyond the wall where he gave them his male babies and then they converted them to white walkers (this is likely where the leader ones come from) but that never really went anywhere after that point.



Posted April 26th by Moonray
Moonray
 



Edited April 26th by The Bandit



Posted April 26th by Xhin
Xhin
Nature is beautiful



Posted April 27th by Moonray
Moonray
 

White Walkers:



And I dunno. I watched that big battle one in, what, season 5? And it was impressive technically, but I found it boring.


I mean, if you don't like action scenes, you don't like action scenes. I'm less enamored of the big battle sequences than I used to be myself, but the Season 5 one really works for me. It has a sense of battlefield positioning, stakes, dynamic tactics, tiny character moments, at least one major plot revelation, and a whole handful of "oh, shit!" moments. All of those things help it to avoid the pitfalls of your typical generic good vs. evil slugfest, at least for me. Plus, it was the first episode that I really cared much about Jon Snow as a character, with his speech before the battle and his leadership/courage during it.

Posted April 27th by white lancer



Posted April 27th by Moonray
Moonray
 

Re: the white walker plot



Also here is a Episode 2 recap video from Alt Shift X. He makes really good and easy-to-follow GoT content.



Posted April 28th by Vandy



Edited April 28th by I killed Mufasa
I killed Mufasa
long live the king



Posted April 28th by Moonray
Moonray
 



Edited April 28th by I killed Mufasa
I killed Mufasa
long live the king

Yea sorry I didn't mean to make it seem like I was including everyone in that reply, just the people it applies to :P



Edited April 28th by Moonray
Moonray
 



Edited April 28th by Vandy

I'll also ask: I see a lot of people talk about "satisfactory conclusions." But like, what do we mean by "satisfactory"? I feel like the show - while I was watching - gave me so man unsatisfactory conclusions to so many threads. Which isn't itself inherently bad. They were conclusions. No rule says you have to provide satisfying ones. Often they made sense. But I don't know that they would be considered what I find "satisfactory conclusions."

So I'm wondering what people think when they say that.

Posted April 28th by Jet Presto

Satisfactory conclusions:




Edited April 28th by I killed Mufasa
I killed Mufasa
long live the king

@Jet Presto

Could you give some examples of unsatisfactory endings to plot threads?

Posted April 28th by Moonray
Moonray
 



Posted April 28th by Renzokuken



Posted April 28th by Vandy

The two character-driven ones I find would be Joffrey and Oberyn.



Posted April 28th by Jet Presto



Posted April 28th by Renzokuken

The White Walkers:



As far as satisfactory endings go, it is partially shaded by the work in question. For me, one of the major themes of the A Song of Ice and Fire novels and at least the first few seasons of Game of Thrones is consequence. Just about every major character who has died in the novels and in the early series, hero or villain (or in-between), has died at least partially as a direct result of their actions. In that respect, it's actually a rather optimistic series: if you act wisely in the world of Westeros and Essos, you will be rewarded, while foolish actions will be punished accordingly. That's actually why a lot of the later seasons of Game of Thrones in particular have fallen flat for me: characters, particularly villains like Ramsay, get away with things not because they're intelligent enough to circumnavigate their consequences, but because of plot reasons. They're allowed to escape the logical consequences of their actions purely because the plot demands that they continue to live. For me, part of what entails a satisfactory death on Game of Thrones is that their consequences catch up to them in a way that makes sense given the world they live in. In that respect, both Joffrey and Oberyn met conclusions that made sense to me. Joffrey's belief that his status as king let him abuse his subjects led directly to his death in a way that made sense, while Oberyn's fixation on revenge led him to a mistake that cost him his life.

That's not the only thing, of course, since that's not the only theme of the series, and it's not the way narrative work. For as much as people say that Game of Thrones is a series where no one is safe, it's still a work that generally tries to follow narrative conventions. One of those is that the goals and motivations of our characters matter, and another is that the time we invest in these characters also matters. We should be expecting some sort of confrontation between the Hound and the Mountain, because we've spent a lot of time exploring the motivations behind such a clash. We should also be expecting that Jon and Daenerys are going to factor into the plot in a major way, because we've invested a lot of time in their storylines despite them not really affecting the larger narrative all that much. If they were to die randomly in battle this next episode, I would find that unsatisfactory because it doesn't relate to their own personal arcs, and because the amount of time the show has invested in following their largely detached storylines would be unworthwhile. If they're just going to die randomly, there was no need to waste that much time on them.

I don't need satisfactory conclusions to minor characters. That's why they're minor characters. But when we invest a lot of time investing in developing and getting to know characters, I expect more than just a random death that doesn't speak to their character arc.



Also here is a Episode 2 recap video from Alt Shift X. He makes really good and easy-to-follow GoT content.


Alt Shift X is awesome, particularly if you're interested in the deeper angles that the books pursue. I've watched every one of his Game of Thrones videos because he's really good at condensing the vast and scattered amounts of information that the books provide, while also talking about how the books and shows might diverge.

Posted April 28th by white lancer



Posted April 28th by Renzokuken



Posted April 28th by Renzokuken
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